9mm side arm

[M1A1ABRAMS]

Interesting in that it does show the penetration of the LeHigh defense bullets. Penetration like this is seldom needed in real life, as is the comparison to shooting through bulletproof glass. The only people I can think of who may want to shoot through bulletproof glass are criminals.
I tried out some LeHigh Defense bullets a few years ago. At the time I had loaded up some hot .380 cartridges and fired them through a Glock 42, one of the few Glock's that I have owned. I was called by my neighbor on the farm where I do a lot of woodchuck shooting who had what was apparently a rabid raccoon trying to get into the house. I was not home when I got the call and drove to the farm with the 380 I had with me to take care of the raccoon. It was loaded with the LeHigh defense bullets.
As I came around the corner the raccoon lost interest in the house and started toward me at a stumbling gate. As soon as it gave me a clear shot away from the house I shot it, hitting it 3 times with the LeHigh bullets, seeing the puff of fur with each shot. The critter slowed down but was still coming. At this point I changed magazines to one loaded with Hornady factory loads shooting the 90 gr FTX. One shot and Mr. Raccoon expired immediately. To be fair, the raccoon had been hit 3 times prior to shooting it with the Hornady's which might have been a factor. I was able to recover one of the LeHigh bullets and found that it had penetrated and continued through the raccoon without expanding at all. I thought that maybe a raccoon was not enough resistance to open the bullet only to find that when shooting at several layers of 2 x 6 pine back home that it stopped in the 3rd board again with no expansion. It looked like the one recovered in the video, no expansion. At the time LeHigh touted that the bullet would segment providing a large wound channel. This was not the case and that was the last time I bought any LeHigh bullets. It is possible they sent the wrong bullets, I never bothered to follow up.

Try one on a BEAR. Isn't that the discussion ? I see value in these bullets when were referring to Bears. Expansion would be nice. But not sure it's really needed here. Especially if you can get more than one shot into the Bear. I could be wrong. I have yet to see these bullets expand in any cartridge. And I do believe you're right about their claim when they came out.

 

[WYO300RUM]

lol. What do you think about "extended" magazines?

. I'm liking the idea the Leihigh extreme 10mm 140 penitrators going through the length of a grizzly. Preferably starting at head. They have some 150 extreme defense that may be even better on bear. I've been carrying 200 and 220 hardcast. I ordered some Penitrators. I'm going to do my own test.

 

[WYO300RUM]

M1A1ABRAMS:
Try one on a BEAR. Isn't that the discussion ? I see value in these bullets when were referring to Bears. Expansion would be nice. But not sure it's really needed here. Especially if you can get more than one shot into the Bear. I could be wrong. I have yet to see these bullets expand in any cartridge. And I do believe you're right about their claim when they came out.

The Penitrators are not designed to expand. They have others for that. Extreme defense, Controlled Chaos, etc. I have some Controled Chaos in 6.5 mm 122 gr.

I've never used on game. Also have their 119 gr. match solid flash tip. I think the tip is magnesium. A mini explosion or something. Have never tried them. Their wicked looking through.

 

[Monster Toms]

One thing about bears and sidearms, black bears tend to come in many different sizes and shapes. What might work well on a 200 pounder could easily fail the test on 375# plus. I skin a lot of bears. Most sub 275# bears don't have much brisket or shoulder meat compared to the bigger ones

 

[M1A1ABRAMS]

. I'm liking the idea the Leihigh extreme 10mm 140 penitrators going through the length of a grizzly. Preferably starting at head. They have some 150 extreme defense that may be even better on bear. I've been carrying 200 and 220 hardcast. I ordered some Penitrators. I'm going to do my own test.

I was surprised by what the F&N 5.7x28 did on bullet proof glass with the F&N ammo. Imagine if you could use a good bullet (armor piercing) in your load. Although not really designed for bears. It possibly could save your life need be. Would be interesting being such a small bullet. And you do have 20 rds at hand. Easy follow up shots with the recoil. If time permits. lol

 

[WYO300RUM]

I was surprised by what the F&N 5.7x28 did on bullet proof glass with the F&N ammo. Imagine if you could use a good bullet (armor piercing) in your load. Although not really designed for bears. It possibly could save your life need be. Would be interesting being such a small bullet. And you do have 20 rds at hand. Easy follow up shots with the recoil. If time permits. lol

Hardly any recoil would be great. If you had time you could maybe get a couple in the head. I'm interested in what the Extreme Penitrators do compared to the hardcast. Trying to think what to use as the bear I'm guessing the 140 gr. E.P. will have somewhat lower recoil that the 200 and 220 gr. Hardcast. Unless the 140 is loader hotter. Don't know.

 

[M1A1ABRAMS]

Hardly any recoil would be great. If you had time you could maybe get a couple in the head. I'm interested in what the Extreme Penitrators do compared to the hardcast. Trying to think what to use as the bear I'm guessing the 140 gr. E.P. will have somewhat lower recoil that the 200 and 220 gr. Hardcast. Unless the 140 is loader hotter. Don't know.

A good dry piece of locust, walnut, oak, hickory, etc wood would probably work well. And easy to come by. At least in my area, east coast. Unless you can find a harder wood in your area. I am not really sure which is the hardest ? I would think locust. It's always a pain to split into firewood. I seen gas wood splitters struggle at times. The old way of splitting is even worst. lol

 

[436]

Interesting in that it does show the penetration of the LeHigh defense bullets. Penetration like this is seldom needed in real life, as is the comparison to shooting through bulletproof glass. The only people I can think of who may want to shoot through bulletproof glass are criminals.
I tried out some LeHigh Defense bullets a few years ago. At the time I had loaded up some hot .380 cartridges and fired them through a Glock 42, one of the few Glock's that I have owned. I was called by my neighbor on the farm where I do a lot of woodchuck shooting who had what was apparently a rabid raccoon trying to get into the house. I was not home when I got the call and drove to the farm with the 380 I had with me to take care of the raccoon. It was loaded with the LeHigh defense bullets.
As I came around the corner the raccoon lost interest in the house and started toward me at a stumbling gate. As soon as it gave me a clear shot away from the house I shot it, hitting it 3 times with the LeHigh bullets, seeing the puff of fur with each shot. The critter slowed down but was still coming. At this point I changed magazines to one loaded with Hornady factory loads shooting the 90 gr FTX. One shot and Mr. Raccoon expired immediately. To be fair, the raccoon had been hit 3 times prior to shooting it with the Hornady's which might have been a factor. I was able to recover one of the LeHigh bullets and found that it had penetrated and continued through the raccoon without expanding at all. I thought that maybe a raccoon was not enough resistance to open the bullet only to find that when shooting at several layers of 2 x 6 pine back home that it stopped in the 3rd board again with no expansion. It looked like the one recovered in the video, no expansion. At the time LeHigh touted that the bullet would segment providing a large wound channel. This was not the case and that was the last time I bought any LeHigh bullets. It is possible they sent the wrong bullets, I never bothered to follow up.

I agree this type of penetration is not really needed much in self-defense other than getting through body armor and/or big-boned critters for which it was designed. The bulletproof glass angle is only a demonstration of the performance of the bullet and cartridge, not the answer to one bullet for everything myth.
Good Raccoon sitrep, yes they are tough little guys, I don't think the Lehigh/Underwood penetrators in any caliber are supposed to explain, the wound channel is based on rotational cavitation, not expansion, so it's not surprising all the bullets looked the same. Back to self-defense; in a 10mm G20SF, I use both the 140gr Underworlds and the 135gr Underwood "clone" my load, based on the 135gr Nosler HP at a little over 1650 fps out of my custom G20SF with a KKM barrel, it's devastating, accurate and very controllable. As for the aforementioned 140gr extreme penetrators, I feel very comfortable on my walkabouts with them.
Like you, I only have two Glock pistols, the G20SF 15+1, and my custom G48 15+1 in both I use Underwood as my woods guns.
I can pick from many of my other 45, 44's .357s, and .38 Super... but!... the "above" two work just great with a high cap load out in the weapon adding in a no mag change for critters. Don't care a lot for Glocks, but... they are reliable, and most pack a lot of ammo into a usable package, I digress... I used 90gr Lehigh/Underwood penetrators in my 9mm G48 and in my Colt Commander series 70 .38 Super... it's running 1675 fps from the Colt, again devastating on all manner of stuff. Ok, this is not a pitch for Lehigh/Underwood, it's just my experience with the product over many years. I have a lot of other ammo I like as well or better depending on the job at hand.
Just my 0.2 Cheers

 

[WYO300RUM]

A good dry piece of locust, walnut, oak, hickory, etc wood would probably work well. And easy to come by. At least in my area, east coast. Unless you can find a harder wood in your area. I am not really sure which is the hardest ? I would think locust. It's always a pain to split into firewood. I seen gas wood splitters struggle at times. The old way of splitting is even worst. lol

I don't see oak in Wy.. In Ca. it's everywhere. I bbq'ed with it a lot. My favorite to bbq and smoke with is mtn. Mohogany. Showed buddies. Hooked on it. Like mesquite also. Back to subject. Soft woods around here. Cottonwood, different pines, etc.. a hard dried anything is going to be better than nothing .

 

[WYO300RUM]

I agree this type of penetration is not really needed much in self-defense other than getting through body armor and/or big-boned critters for which it was designed. The bulletproof glass angle is only a demonstration of the performance of the bullet and cartridge, not the answer to one bullet for everything myth.
Good Raccoon sitrep, yes they are tough little guys, I don't think the Lehigh/Underwood penetrators in any caliber are supposed to explain, the wound channel is based on rotational cavitation, not expansion, so it's not surprising all the bullets looked the same. Back to self-defense; in a 10mm G20SF, I use both the 140gr Underworlds and the 135gr Underwood "clone" my load, based on the 135gr Nosler HP at a little over 1650 fps out of my custom G20SF with a KKM barrel, it's devastating, accurate and very controllable. As for the aforementioned 140gr extreme penetrators, I feel very comfortable on my walkabouts with them.
Like you, I only have two Glock pistols, the G20SF 15+1, and my custom G48 15+1 in both I use Underwood as my woods guns.
I can pick from many of my other 45, 44's .357s, and .38 Super... but!... the "above" two work just great with a high cap load out in the weapon adding in a no mag change for critters. Don't care a lot for Glocks, but... they are reliable, and most pack a lot of ammo into a usable package, I digress... I used 90gr Lehigh/Underwood penetrators in my 9mm G48 and in my Colt Commander series 70 .38 Super... it's running 1675 fps from the Colt, again devastating on all manner of stuff. Ok, this is not a pitch for Lehigh/Underwood, it's just my experience with the product over many years. I have a lot of other ammo I like as well or better depending on the job at hand.
Just my 0.2 Cheers





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I wish I still had my Colt 38 super . I have a Glock 20 and a Springfield XDM 10 mm. I like the Glock hands down and what I carry in the woods. It's more accurate and controllable. Plus no grip safety. I installed a 3.5 lb. trigger bar in the Glock 30. Lowered it to 5 lbs. In my Glock 21 .45 it lowerd it to 3.5 lbs. exactly. It's tricked out but don't want to carry it in the woods. I like my Glock 48 9mm but don't care for the Glock 44 .22 I have.

 

[ajkellerusmc]

I'm happy you shoot your Glock well….wasn't the question I asked however. The post I was responding to was in regards to a ballistics conversation where I didn't realize the 10mm was in spitting distance to the 357 mag and credited the gentleman who brought it to my attention. I DON'T shoot my Glock well but the gentleman had mentioned that Sig now has a P320 in 10mm, I asked if that was also available in the caliber X change kits they offer for the P320 (I have one and shoot my P320 well).

Learn to dry fire that glock a few thousand times and it will be just accurate as any of the other pistols mentioned- trigger manipulation is the key to being accurate with any handgun.

 

[jbronner13]

Learn to dry fire that glock a few thousand times and it will be just accurate as any of the other pistols mentioned- trigger manipulation is the key to being accurate with any handgun.

It's my tiny little sausage fingers , I am looking into the apex flat triggers for it, much easier for me to reach. I have found myself far more accurate with the smaller framed pistols (thinner, usually single stacks) and a flat trigger or triggers with a shorter distance to get to.

 

[ajkellerusmc]

It's my tiny little sausage fingers , I am looking into the apex flat triggers for it, much easier for me to reach. I have found myself far more accurate with the smaller framed pistols (thinner, usually single stacks) and a flat trigger or triggers with a shorter distance to get to.

got cha, My hands are so big I cannot hold the smaller guns and in fact on my G-20 I had to add one of the backstrap pieces to make the gun fit my hand better. One size do not fit all, Cheers!

 

[sea2summit]

Learn to dry fire that glock a few thousand times and it will be just accurate as any of the other pistols mentioned- trigger manipulation is the key to being accurate with any handgun.

I've owned all the Gens, wasn't until 5 I could actually shoot one really well. Only one I never gave up was my Gen 3 35 and it sat neglected for years so I pulled it out after crushing stuff with the Gen 5 for a while....still no luck with the 3. It groups well but nowhere near where it should (about 7" high at 20 yards). Ohh whale, that's why you must test your guns.