6.5 Creedmor- the Holy Grail?

[Pbethell]

I know I am going to get a bunch of flack for posting this, but....

In a recent conversation with a friend of mine, who has a grand slam of sheep on his bedroom wall, and a super slam of the rest of the game animals in North America less a barren ground caribou, I was told during a conversation about accurate smaller caliber rounds that he has four friends, who this year each lost mature elk bulls each with a 140 grain bullet reasonable well placed from a 6.5 Creedmor.
This cartridge, to me, seems to have the ability in many of its proponents minds to be the holy grail of all cartridge designs. It is sad when common sense is put back in the gun locker when any of us take to the woods with a weapon that doesn't really fill the bill for the game we hunt, when we know we have the horsepower in the locker to do the job properly.
Elmer Keith who we all know loved the .270 Winchester. But his favorite for hunting and guiding for elk is reported to be the .375 H&H. He also loved the .338 Win Mag.
Dead is Dead, but wounded is usually also dead but with a heavy dose of suffering to go with it.
I own a .338 Win Mag and have made it a point to be able to shoot it comfortably. I also own 2 25-06's and 3 .243's. I use the latter to plink, for my grandchildren to shoot deer, and for just a fun day on the range. When the hunt is on for me and as a back up it is 7mm Rem Mag, 7mm Exact or .338 Win Mag. Common sense to see that Dead is Dead when I pull the trigger on something worth shooting.

I really agree with all of the above EXCEPT I believe you have a couple of well known "Gun Writers" mixed up. Jack O'Connor had a love affair with the 270, and promoted it heavily. Elmer K ridiculed him in print for years over the 270, calling it a "Coyote gun at best". I understand in private, they laughed about all this, but so it was. However, you are correct IMO about the 6.5CM lacking punch, especially at the longer ranges that so many tout. It may work well for punching ringing steel at 1000 yards, but many are now mistakenly believing it is the cure all for most everythi, at unbelievable distances.

 

[Graymun]

View attachment 114284

 

[James Bailey]

I lost an axis deer this year with a 6.5 Grendel..I think mostly due to bullet design, but a 6.5 is on the very light side for these robust deer. I know I will hear how many moose are taken with a 6.5x55 etc etc...

I find it funny, when you mention 30 and 33 caliber here you are shooting a cannon, but in Africa I pull out a 375 and no one raises an eyebrow.

I still say if I had one gun I'd take my 338 Norma or my 375 ultra. I know some will say i didn't know elk have bullet proof vests etc... it for the man that does not live in elk, or moose country--some of us draw or pay for very expensive tags. I can tell you having a little extra never hurts.

I have a very good friend that has shot a ton of game--hunted almost everything from Markhor to stone sheep...his choice is a 300 weatherby...his other gun 375 HH imp. He told me no one ever scoffed at him for showing up with a 300 mag....

I regularly hunt with a 223 and a 6.5x47...but I can tell you if I were paying for a Aoudad, whitetail, or axis hunt..I'd take more gun...I can pick and choose my shots--I can hunt almost any day I am home..and on more than one occasion I have longed for more rifle.

I remember one windy day I spotted a really nice ram on the side of a hill. My brother and I worked ourselves into position, he was a heavy broomed Aoudad feeding up and away--I had my McMillan talon 257 WBY with us loaded with 100 grain Speer bullets...a 257 is a hammer on Aoudad, but this guy was at about 475 yards feeding away. Wind was blowing about 20 and we would have to hoof it to make up any ground. We let him walk--and I never saw that ol monster again. I longed for my 7mm R.E.M. Mag. I would have taken the shot with my 338 Norma, 300 Norma, 7 mag, etc...just think, if I would have paid 5k and it was the last day..shooting a little more gun and practice with a bit heavier caliber would have paid off.

Zeeve told me long ago--shoot the heaviest caliber you can shoot accurately when you go to a new location it will pay dividends.

Amen to that!

 

[James Bailey]

As always, numbers fo not lie. In this modern world, we have ability to accurately project energy. There are many calibers out there that produce more energy than the creedmoor that are considered marginal on elk sized game and even big whitetail or mule deer. Axis deer, even the does don't die easily either. Bottom line, if you can afford an elk hunt, you can afford a rifle capable if cleanly killing one. I'm going on a hunt in two days with the opportunity to shoot a 160+ whitetail. Do I need a 30 Nosler with a 180 accubond? Not really, but it won't hurt and for this kind of money, I'd just as soon not have to look for him. Given the opportunity, I'm going to send that 180 through both shoulders and have no worries!

 

[J E Custom]

WOW !! I thought I would read the latest post and did not realize how far this post had gone.

It still looks like lots of different opinions and everything that can be said for or against has been said. so it will remain a controversy/ opinion.

It has been an interesting post though.

J E CUSTOM

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Here is the recovered 143 gr eld x from the 6x6 bull elk taken at 934 yards.

Good impact vel for a 450-500g bullet from a 45-70.

 

[FIGJAM]

As always, numbers fo not lie. In this modern world, we have ability to accurately project energy. There are many calibers out there that produce more energy than the creedmoor that are considered marginal on elk sized game and even big whitetail or mule deer. Axis deer, even the does don't die easily either. Bottom line, if you can afford an elk hunt, you can afford a rifle capable if cleanly killing one. I'm going on a hunt in two days with the opportunity to shoot a 160+ whitetail. Do I need a 30 Nosler with a 180 accubond? Not really, but it won't hurt and for this kind of money, I'd just as soon not have to look for him. Given the opportunity, I'm going to send that 180 through both shoulders and have no worries!

The two bull elk killed at over 900 yards in wolff's post on page 35 with the 143gr eldx in the creedmoor seemed like pretty clean kills to me.

My elk tag costs $33.75. I guess with gas and food I am probably into an elk hunt for around $100. I guess all you non residents that can afford expensive tags have to go buy 30 cal magnum rifles if you want to hunt elk. Us locals can keep using those inadequate calibers like the 6.5 creedmoor or 260 rem, maybe the 7mm08 or 270 win. Sigh...

 

[Steve Sheasly]

I know I am going to get a bunch of flack for posting this, but....

In a recent conversation with a friend of mine, who has a grand slam of sheep on his bedroom wall, and a super slam of the rest of the game animals in North America less a barren ground caribou, I was told during a conversation about accurate smaller caliber rounds that he has four friends, who this year each lost mature elk bulls each with a 140 grain bullet reasonable well placed from a 6.5 Creedmor.
This cartridge, to me, seems to have the ability in many of its proponents minds to be the holy grail of all cartridge designs. It is sad when common sense is put back in the gun locker when any of us take to the woods with a weapon that doesn't really fill the bill for the game we hunt, when we know we have the horsepower in the locker to do the job properly.
Elmer Keith who we all know loved the .270 Winchester. But his favorite for hunting and guiding for elk is reported to be the .375 H&H. He also loved the .338 Win Mag.
Dead is Dead, but wounded is usually also dead but with a heavy dose of suffering to go with it.
I own a .338 Win Mag and have made it a point to be able to shoot it comfortably. I also own 2 25-06's and 3 .243's. I use the latter to plink, for my grandchildren to shoot deer, and for just a fun day on the range. When the hunt is on for me and as a back up it is 7mm Rem Mag, 7mm Exact or .338 Win Mag. Common sense to see that Dead is Dead when I pull the trigger on something worth shooting.

I have been hunting and killing elk in the Blue Mountains of Oregon on private ranches for decades starting in the 1970s. I have killed a pile of them --- I have used a 270, 270 wsm, 243 (bad choice buy my son ws 14 and it killed an elk), 7mm mag, 338 win, 30-06, 308 win, now all I hunt elk with is a 338 Lapua Magnum if the elk does not die it is my fault. I have looked at the 6.5 CM and prefer my 270 wsm to it. The 6.5 just gave people something new to buy and try. Nothing takes the place of the ability to put the bullet in the right place no gun shoots itself it is the operator.

 

[Steve Sheasly]

Good impact vel for a 450-500g bullet from a 45-70.

yes and a trajectory that would make an astronaut blush.

 

[Longranger7mm]

View attachment 114284

Thank you! Thank you VERY MUCH!!

 

[Longranger7mm]

I've heard it's easier to kill moose than elk. Elk are like overgrown deer...I've seen some whitetails absorb perfect vitals shots from some powerful guns and were dead-man running, and still went 100 yards through a briar patch. I've seen some bad hunters in my years in the woods...Met even more selling guns and equipment to them. Hearing some of their stories, and seeing some of the shots made when we used to have our big buck contest every year, was quite eye-opening to see just how many un-practiced and untrained folks lurking around out there in the woods. Folks like that is one of the main reasons I stopped hunting public land down here.

Hell a lot of people don't even see if the weapon is even zeroed before they hunt with it from year to year, let alone shoot it during the year! Practice who needs practice I have a scope!!

 

[BigGrizz]

Keith hated O'connor and history has shown Elmer was not nearly as vindictive as Jack. I am a devoted Keith student, and bullet designs today may enable smaller calibers to perform beyond their traditional capabilities, but the same is even more true for larger calibers that so many seem to try and replicate with hot new rebrandings.

 

[Ranchpilot]

"For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace."

Merry Christmas!!

For some reason the 6.5 CM doesn't seem all that important today.

 

[Steve Sheasly]

Hell a lot of people don't even see if the weapon is even zeroed before they hunt with it from year to year, let alone shoot it during the year! Practice who needs practice I have a scope!!

Elk are like a big deer like a hippo is to a mouse. Deer die easily .I have shot elk in the lungs and tracked am for 4 or 5 hours .They can run dead .I am convinced. It does not take a large caliber to kill a moose but I do not take chances .They are 2 elk and I do not want them wandering back into the muskeg where it becomes a 3 day pack.