6.5 Creedmoor for Cow Elk

[FIGJAM]

We sell a lot of .264 cal bullets, and I am sure it is due to the popularity of the 6.5 Creed. I think people just need to realize that there is no magic in the caliber or the cartridge. The 6.5 Creed is what it is, a small caliber, small cartridge chambering. It is a bit of a step up from a .243 win and a bit of a step down from a 7-08. Keep your impact vel up and select a bullet that can penetrate deep with proper deformation. In these small chamberings it is a much more critical bullet choice. On elk you need to be selective about shot placement. Shot placement should be looked at like you would if archery hunting. No hard quartering shots and try to avoid the shoulder.

That is a true statement with regards to bullet diameter only isn't it? The magic is that they make heavy for caliber bullets in 6.5 with high ballistic coefficients and most factory guns come with twists capable of stabilizing them. They do the same thing for 7mms, but heavy for caliber means you are up in the 160gr plus. Most people who shoot a 7mm08 shoot 120-140 gr bullets. Unless you shoot 168 gr bullets in a 7mm08, I dont' see how the 6.5 is a step down? Also, it is a pretty big step up from a 243. Once again focusing on bullet weights.

 

[hunter67wa]

Well said Rocky on bullet placement.

 

[RockyMtnMT]

That is a true statement with regards to bullet diameter only isn't it? The magic is that they make heavy for caliber bullets in 6.5 with high ballistic coefficients and most factory guns come with twists capable of stabilizing them. They do the same thing for 7mms, but heavy for caliber means you are up in the 160gr plus. Most people who shoot a 7mm08 shoot 120-140 gr bullets. Unless you shoot 168 gr bullets in a 7mm08, I dont' see how the 6.5 is a step down? Also, it is a pretty big step up from a 243. Once again focusing on bullet weights.

Bullet dia is under rated. Along with impact vel. There is no replacement for displacement. I'll take a 130g bullet from a 7-08 over a 140g bullet from a Creed every day for elk. Remember neither is good for long range elk.

 

[FIGJAM]

Bullet dia is under rated. Along with impact vel. There is no replacement for displacement. I'll take a 130g bullet from a 7-08 over a 140g bullet from a Creed every day for elk. Remember neither is good for long range elk.

Assuming equal velocity and bullet construction, the bullet with the higher sectional density, in this case the 140 gr 6.5 vs the 130gr or even 140 gr 7mm, will penetrate better. The 7mm08 may be your personal preference, but there is no merit to the claim that a 7mm08 will perform better than a 6.5 creedmoor, all else (shot placement, velocity being equal). In fact the higher bc of the 6.5 140 allows the bullet to retain more energy at longer distances than your 130gr 7mm08 bullet.

I will be the first to admit I thought this 6.5 stuff was a bunch of snake oil. Then I bought my son a 6.5 creedmoor and saw how it performed on game. So I went out and bought me a 260 rem. I am in the process of putting together a 26 nosler. Apparently I am drinking the koolaid. I am guessing you don't own or at least don't hunt with a 6.5. That's cool, to each there own, but you can't confuse personal preference with adequacy and performance of a particular cartridge. When I was researching a caliber for my son, I had it narrowed down to the 7mm08 and the 6.5 creedmoor. When you run the numbers, and I did (several times), the 6.5 won. We live in idaho, so I was taking into consideration longer range shots and retained energy. I was also looking at factory rifles.

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Assuming equal velocity and bullet construction, the bullet with the higher sectional density, in this case the 140 gr 6.5 vs the 130gr or even 140 gr 7mm, will penetrate better. The 7mm08 may be your personal preference, but there is no merit to the claim that a 7mm08 will perform better than a 6.5 creedmoor, all else (shot placement, velocity being equal). In fact the higher bc of the 6.5 140 allows the bullet to retain more energy at longer distances than your 130gr 7mm08 bullet.

I will be the first to admit I thought this 6.5 stuff was a bunch of snake oil. Then I bought my son a 6.5 creedmoor and saw how it performed on game. So I went out and bought me a 260 rem. I am in the process of putting together a 26 nosler. Apparently I am drinking the koolaid. I am guessing you don't own or at least don't hunt with a 6.5. That's cool, to each there own, but you can't confuse personal preference with adequacy and performance of a particular cartridge. When I was researching a caliber for my son, I had it narrowed down to the 7mm08 and the 6.5 creedmoor. When you run the numbers, and I did (several times), the 6.5 won. We live in idaho, so I was taking into consideration longer range shots and retained energy. I was also looking at factory rifles.

You assume a lot. That's ok. You only mentioned one cartridge that I would put into the long range category.

Yes sectional density is a very good indicator of on game performance.

You missed my point. Impact vel and bullet dia are more important than bc. Bc is pretty much mute until beyond about 500y. The creed is not a 500y elk cartridge.

 

[FIGJAM]

You assume a lot. That's ok. You only mentioned one cartridge that I would put into the long range category.

Yes sectional density is a very good indicator of on game performance.

You missed my point. Impact vel and bullet dia are more important than bc. Bc is pretty much mute until beyond about 500y. The creed is not a 500y elk cartridge.

Even though you state it like a fact, that's just your opinion brother - we are all entitled to them, doesn't mean they are true. Lots of guys on this site killing elk at 500 and beyond with those little 6.5 cartridges.

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Even though you state it like a fact, that's just your opinion brother - we are all entitled to them, doesn't mean they are true. Lots of guys on this site killing elk at 500 and beyond with those little 6.5 cartridges.

Unfortunately you are right.

 

[trhall]

Just curious why you think it is funny to watch local elk hunters from western states carrying non magnum calibers???? Most of them have probably shot one or more elk every year since they were teenagers, often on their property or adjcent forest land.

They typically know their conditions, probably can almost predict where they are going to shoot from and to, prior to heading out in the early morning hours.

When you have killed large cows or steers with a hammer or a 22 pistol prior to butchering, you realize that you don't need a 338 lapua to kill an elk. Not that it is bad to use one, if you can shoot one well and are familiar with it.

But an accurate and well shot .25-06/.260/6.5 Creedmoor/.270 or .280 or equivalent is certainly sufficient particularly if you shoot well; even for bull elk. Most can get within 350 yards or less and most have been shooting game, predators and varmits since they were kids. We grew up hunting gophers and magpies for a nickle or dime a pair of legs or a tail when we were young. I know I have killed a few elk with a 6 mm remington. And maybe a .220 swift although would probably not admit to that. Shot placement and knowing your conditions and equipment make for efficient elk kills.

To the OP, as many have stated, you will be fine with your 6.5 creedmoor and 140 VLD. If you don't know, Elk is probably the best tasting and finest eating of north american big game. Have fun and hope you go home with a big elk cow.

I think this was meant tongue in cheek. I think the point he was trying to make was that seems like alot of folks think you need a big 30 or 338 magnum to kill elk these days.

 

[Teknys]

As one of the guys that live out west (Idaho), Yes most of the guns I see used for Elk are the same as the deer rifles, 243W up to 30 cals. 260 Rem from my 12y son at the time was bang - flop on a 6pt Bull.

I will say this - There are 2 kinds of ELK.... BIG Bulls and then the rest. When I hunt bulls I use my 300WSM with 180PT or 200AB, Cows - what ever strikes me that year. Do not need a large caliper to take a standing cow when you can wait for the shot. You will see hundreds of cows between seeing a large bull measured sometimes in years on public land so when it's game on for a bull - use enough to take the shoulder if needed.

6.5 caliper of Creedmoor, Rem or Norma - Just use the appropriate bullet.

 

[MASH]

26 Nosler with a Berger 140 did the job, 423yds on the cow in my Avatar.

 

[74bronco]

6mm slr with a 115gr vldh@ 3100 fps at 380 yards on a big roosevelt 6x6 here on the west coast , DRT , bullet placement is key. a forky and 5x6 also first season this november with 6.5 creed and the 143 eldx. neither of them moved more then 5 yrds either. hell my hunting partner sold his 300 mag after seeing what my 6mm did to the heart and lungs on that bull and got a 6.5 creed , he took the 5x6 with it. mostly because his old 300 wouldn't group and the ruger American predator out of box and with factory loads shoots sub moa, got to have confidence in your gun and in placing shots.

 

[diddlyv]

I ate 9 elk taken by my father who swore by his 94 winchester 26 inch barreled .32 special in the 50s and early 60s. The lone 6x6 bull he took with a heart shot ran 1/4 mile down hill with an exploded heart. Most of the cows were neck shots at .25 to 75 yard and were drt. Our neighbor killed a elk every year with a 270, another friends dad killed elk and moose with a Krag Carbine. Back in the day a 3006 was a big gun for elk. Bottom line all those mentioned could shoot and were good enough hunters to get close and put meat on the table. The meat on the table thing explains the sole bull my father shot - Big old bulls just don't taste as good as cows, calves and spikes and one simply cannot eat the horns.
After several thousand years of evolution, Elk have suddenly mutated so much in the last 50 years one almost believes the 120 mm main gun of an Abrams is not quite enough gun.

 

[hunter67wa]

Thats the internet for you. I have magazines from the 50's and 60's and they all said a well placed shot anchors everything. duh

 

[codyadams]

I probably should have said its funny to watch us easterners with Ultra magnums...kind of came out backwards I guess. They guy whos ranch land we were hunting on in Wyoming killed his cow that year with a 6mm Remington. That was his truck gun.

I have to agree ha ha. I have lived here in Wyoming my entire life, started hunting with my dad when I was very young, began going on elk hunts with him when I was 7, and have killed elk nearly every year since I was 12. I'm now 29. My father used a 300 win mag for a while, because we moved from California when I was 4, and that is what he was told he "needed" for elk ha ha. That rifle has since been rebarreled to a .264 wm, and is only used when longer range shots will be likely. Other than that, we have used a 6mm remington, a 7mm-08, .308's, a lot of 30-06's, a 6.5x55 sweed, my .260 AI, and one 8mm-06, never lost one and never had to track more than 50 or so yards, with nearly all being DRT at the shot. Granted, the vast majority of our hunts for elk were all sub 300 yards while sneaking through timber. The 300 wm and rum is simply not necessary unless you are shooting extended range though. I am currently putting together a .338 Norma mag, in the more recent years my elk have been taken with my .260 AI at 700+, and at that range retained energy of the 338 norma is similar to the trusty 30-06 at point blank out to 300 yards. My .260 AI has been between 1300 ft. Lbs and 1500 ft. Lbs and worked, but I'm used to seeing the 30-06 at sub 200 energy on elk effect. It seems when hunting out here, we either see elk under 100 yards if we're hunting timber, or over 600 if glassing. A running elk at 75 yards in timber is a lower odds shot for me than a calm one at 750, so I'm building a .338 Norma.

It does make me laugh to myself though, I talked to a fellow last year on the mountain, he had taken a shot at an elk he stated was around 300 slowly walking off, and I noticed he had a fresh cut above his right eye. Asked him what he was shooting....sure enough, 300 RUM he had bought just for this DIY Wyoming elk hunt ha ha. He was from somewhere back east, I want to say Ohio. I would bet if he was using a .308, 6.5 cm, 7mm-08, or something he wasn't afraid to shoot, he likely would have had meat on the ground. The majority of the rums and similar are either carried by inexperienced/unsuccessful people, or those competent at long range, from my observations in my years of meeting and talking to people on the mountain.