358 Winchester performance at 300 yds

[cwlongshot]

Another 35 caliber fan here. Its started with the first "deer rifle" I bought myself about 1982/83. It was a older Browning BLR in 358 Win. WOW WOW! My experience shooting deer at that time where a few with a bow and two more with my Grandfathers 8mm Mauser with Factory 170g Federals. Bow deer of coarse always ran some got out of site, all died within 100 yards. The 8mm Deer where both hit well and dropped in site.
The first one with the 358 was about 80 yards high shoulder. That deer "sucked" its legs up to its body. Fell straight down. Bounced out stretched its head/neck and slowly rolled onto its side. OOH BABY I HAD A HAMMER!!!! The next few years resulted in DRT after DRT not one made a step. Then one morning a few deer stood facing me @ first light. I looked them over close found sizable horns dropped X hairs to under that white spot and squeezed. That deer almost ran me down!!!!! But literally ran past that I could have touched him as he past had I not moved. He ran smack into a tree 20 -30' behind me and died. That 200g ST had exited just in-front of the hind quarters and creased that ham.
In 1986 I had a 35 Whelen built on a Argentine Mauser. It has a 25" Shillen Barrel and Bell n Carlson pounder stock. I loaded that with 200g Hornadys over 2520 @ just shy of 2900 fps. I have had shoulder shots fail to exit. I switched to the 225 Sierra thinking it tougher. It was not, I went to the 225 Accu-Bond bullet.
About 5 years ago I bought a 358 Norma Mag on a Winchester pusher 26" bbl. That gun with 4350 pushes a 250g Oryx bullet to 2870 fps! I have yet to "christen" that rifle.
Along the way I bought a couple 35 Remington levers and took a few deer with 200g RN Hornadys. I always wanted a Marlin 336 35 Rem.

When I started hunting local small Parcels. I switched to a H&R single shot in 357 Maximum. That rifle was perfectly suited for the thick close short shots and its taken a few dozen deer. Only a few of those have walked from its 180g bullet at about 2200 fps.

I love these 35 cal rifles!!

CW

 

[Lionel Boyd Johnson]

Curious which 180 grain bullet you load in the .357 Maximum?

Have you any experience with the 200 grain Remington Core-Lokt round nose in .35 caliber? I loaded some for my .35 Whelen, mid book velocity range and took a nice buck with one this year. Deer was angling away at about 70 yards so I aimed to enter near the back of the on-side ribs and have the bullet angle through to the off-side shoulder. The buck hunched up, took 3 steps with obviously broken off-front-side shoulder and fell over.

 

[Otto6555]

Another 35 caliber fan here. Its started with the first "deer rifle" I bought myself about 1982/83. It was a older Browning BLR in 358 Win. WOW WOW! My experience shooting deer at that time where a few with a bow and two more with my Grandfathers 8mm Mauser with Factory 170g Federals. Bow deer of coarse always ran some got out of site, all died within 100 yards. The 8mm Deer where both hit well and dropped in site.
The first one with the 358 was about 80 yards high shoulder. That deer "sucked" its legs up to its body. Fell straight down. Bounced out stretched its head/neck and slowly rolled onto its side. OOH BABY I HAD A HAMMER!!!! The next few years resulted in DRT after DRT not one made a step. Then one morning a few deer stood facing me @ first light. I looked them over close found sizable horns dropped X hairs to under that white spot and squeezed. That deer almost ran me down!!!!! But literally ran past that I could have touched him as he past had I not moved. He ran smack into a tree 20 -30' behind me and died. That 200g ST had exited just in-front of the hind quarters and creased that ham.
In 1986 I had a 35 Whelen built on a Argentine Mauser. It has a 25" Shillen Barrel and Bell n Carlson pounder stock. I loaded that with 200g Hornadys over 2520 @ just shy of 2900 fps. I have had shoulder shots fail to exit. I switched to the 225 Sierra thinking it tougher. It was not, I went to the 225 Accu-Bond bullet.
About 5 years ago I bought a 358 Norma Mag on a Winchester pusher 26" bbl. That gun with 4350 pushes a 250g Oryx bullet to 2870 fps! I have yet to "christen" that rifle.
Along the way I bought a couple 35 Remington levers and took a few deer with 200g RN Hornadys. I always wanted a Marlin 336 35 Rem.

When I started hunting local small Parcels. I switched to a H&R single shot in 357 Maximum. That rifle was perfectly suited for the thick close short shots and its taken a few dozen deer. Only a few of those have walked from its 180g bullet at about 2200 fps.

I love these 35 cal rifles!!

CW

I'm all in on the 358 Winchester it's a very very underrated and understood caliber and if I had to have one caliber for 250 yards and back my 358 would be my instant choice because as my meat processor said when I work up the deer all we throw away is the bullet hole because there is No bloodshot meat on it whatsoever and he's been processing my deer for 15 plus years!!

 

[cwlongshot]

Curious which 180 grain bullet you load in the .357 Maximum?

Have you any experience with the 200 grain Remington Core-Lokt round nose in .35 caliber? I loaded some for my .35 Whelen, mid book velocity range and took a nice buck with one this year. Deer was angling away at about 70 yards so I aimed to enter near the back of the on-side ribs and have the bullet angle through to the off-side shoulder. The buck hunched up, took 3 steps with obviously broken off-front-side shoulder and fell over.

Old stock Hornady SSP. Single shot pistol bullet. I bought a bunch when they was discontinued.

 

[Alibiiv]

I shot two deer this year with a 358 Winchester Hornady 200 gr. SP traveling at approximately 2300 fps. Both went 4 legs up immediately. I like the performance of this caliber/bullet at this velocity. I'd like to buy a barrel/gun that can mimic this velocity and performance at 250 to 400 yards. I'm thinking 35 Whelan or 358 Norma mag in a 26" barrel.

Any input would be appreciated.

Jim

I know that this is an older thread, however I opened it due to the fact that I have shot game with the .358 Winchester. I presently have one and I am about to buy another Wilson Combat NULA in .358 Winchester. However it will be for hunting black bear over bait. I do not believe that the .358 Winchester or the 35 Whelen is going to give you the performance you are looking for. The Whelen is a great cartridge out to 300 yards, after that it turns into a mortar round. I would like to suggest that you take a look at the 338-06 if you want to reach that performance with a medium bore cartridge.

 

[Otto6555]

I know that this is an older thread, however I opened it due to the fact that I have shot game with the .358 Winchester. I presently have one and I am about to buy another Wilson Combat NULA in .358 Winchester. However it will be for hunting black bear over bait. I do not believe that the .358 Winchester or the 35 Whelen is going to give you the performance you are looking for. The Whelen is a great cartridge out to 300 yards, after that it turns into a mortar round. I would like to suggest that you take a look at the 338-06 if you want to reach that performance with a medium bore cartridge.

Are you looking at the Wilson One on Gunbroker??
If you get that one let us know how it shoots
And i agree I love my 358 Winchester but its no 300 yard gun by 100 yards at least
They kill fantasticly well with very very little meat loose but I'm like you I would step it up a bit on speed and that 338-06 would be a good one to start with and move up the ladder with charges and see how much you can get out of it

 

[cwlongshot]

Sorry guys to say the 338 is enough "better to warrant it over the 35's is kidding your self.

The ballistic advantage of a 338 of same weight as a 35 fired at basically same velocities, is gonna do nothing till ya get out past 275/300 and by then all these are slowing down quite similarly.

Advantage out past 300 is gonna be in a big 7mm or better still a 300 Magnum and big power is gonna take rounds like the 338 Lapua and one of the big Weatherby's.

The 35's are not quite as short range as you read and are telling folks.

CW

 

[Alibiiv]

Are you looking at the Wilson One on Gunbroker??
If you get that one let us know how it shoots
And i agree I love my 358 Winchester but its no 300 yard gun by 100 yards at least
They kill fantasticly well with very very little meat loose but I'm like you I would step it up a bit on speed and that 338-06 would be a good one to start with and move up the ladder with charges and see how much you can get out of it

Yes I did look at the one on GunSmoker. It is priced a bit higher than I want to pay. I actually found the dealer and called them. The dealer on GunSmoker has a starting bid of $2750 with a buy-it-now price of $2995. I asked the dealer if he could sharpen his pencil a bit. He offered to take $50 off the buy-it-now price. I have a LGS that will sell the rifle to me for $2500, but presently WILSON COMBAT ISNT MAKING THEM

 

[Alibiiv]

I wonder if necking up a 300 prc to 358 would get you there?

I was thinking along these lines. I tried to buy a Ruger 77 in .300WSM so that I could rebarrel it to .358/.300WSM, however the bidder had to have wanted that rifle real bad.

 

[Alibiiv]

Hornady 358 200 gr. SP is not the bullet it was back in the 90's.....in my BLR needed some bullets in 2014 loaded them the same as always recieved a bear tag in Michigan shot a 300 lb. bear broadside at 80 yards just in back of the shoulder hit one rib the bullet only penetrated about 9" but came apart like a varmit bullet biggest piece found was 58 grains plus a bunch of much smaller pieces....
I was very leary to use the same bullet come deer season but did any ways shot a nice 8 point 198 pounds dressed quartering away hit near the last rib going forward only 7-8" of penetration distroying only one lung it came apart like the one I shot the bear with was a very long tracking job luckly there was over a foot of snow....bad part I just couldn't leave the deer until the next day because of wolves in the aera....
With that deer it was the last Hornady bullet I have ever used for hunting only will use Cutting Edge Bullets now !

I have been using the Barnes 225gr TSX bullets in the Whelen with devastating performance. I have never recovered a bullet ever. I have used the Barnes 200gr TTSX bullet in the .358 Winchester, again never recovered a bullet and devastating performance. The photo is of a black bear that I shot in 2018 with the Whelen, it was quartering to my left slightly. The bullet entered center mass in the chest area and exited behind the left shoulder. The last bear that I shot with the .358 was a broadside shot, just behind the shoulders. That round broke both shoulders, the bear ran about 25 feet and died.

 

[VinceMule]

Whatever gun you are shooting, if you know the range, and can dial in yardage and windage, you are good to go.

Being able to practice at the typical yardage you are going to hunt will teach limitations you have with your rig and abilities.

If you are a point shooter using hold over, using the highest BC bullet with the fastest velocity is GOLD!

The Barnes TTSX 160g in 338 is a force to be reckoned with, I don't think you will ever recover one in a deer, Black Bear, or elk. I shot this bullet in a Rem 700 338 WM with fantastic results on the game after watching a mule riding partner use them in a 338/06 on elk. Two other riding partners used the 120g TSX in 7 Mag and another used a 25/06 with 120g Partitions. Between those three guys, they had taken over a hundred head.

Lesson learned, you want something that shoots flat enough to where you will not impact low in the body on misjudged range. Stuff is not hard to kill, just put the bullet where it is supposed to go.

 

[Alibiiv]

Im going to rebore a 338 win to 358 and rechamber to 358 Norma, but havent gotten to it yet. Ive done some research of facts and anecdotes, but have no firsthand info

We have three Ruger 77s that started life out as 30-06 Springfields, and they now are 35 Whelens. JES reboring in Oregon (?) did the rebore. It was about a three week turnaround, it was $250 at that time, however that was 3-4 years ago. The rifles will shoot MOA if I do my job. We shoot 8 inch steel plates at 300 yards, the rounds hit that steel with some authority. I am reading a lot about bullet designs. I wrote in a previous reply that we have had good performance using the Barnes 225gr TSX bullets in the Whelen. Right now I have some Hammer 223gr Stone Hammer bullets for the Whelen that I intend to use on my next bear hunt. We are hunting over bait from a ground blind, 50-60 yard shots. It will be interesting to see what the performance will be.

 

[cwlongshot]

We have three Ruger 77s that started life out as 30-06 Springfields, and they now are 35 Whelens. JES reboring in Oregon (?) did the rebore. It was about a three week turnaround, it was $250 at that time, however that was 3-4 years ago. The rifles will shoot MOA if I do my job. We shoot 8 inch steel plates at 300 yards, the rounds hit that steel with some authority. I am reading a lot about bullet designs. I wrote in a previous reply that we have had good performance using the Barnes 225gr TSX bullets in the Whelen. Right now I have some Hammer 223gr Stone Hammer bullets for the Whelen that I intend to use on my next bear hunt. We are hunting over bait from a ground blind, 50-60 yard shots. It will be interesting to see what the performance will be.

JES did my Winchester 7mag to a 358 Norma some ten years back. Its a very good shooter and a favorite rifle of mine. It has a 25.5" bbl and top loads are scarry fast.
I have a 308 Savage 99 thats destined for this same ride and re birth to the wonderful little 358 Winchester.

Good luck with yours!!

CW

 

[Bghunter338]

JES did my Winchester 7mag to a 358 Norma some ten years back. Its a very good shooter and a favorite rifle of mine. It has a 25.5" bbl and top loads are scarry fast.
I have a 308 Savage 99 thats destined for this same ride and re birth to the wonderful little 358 Winchester.

Good luck with yours!!

CW

How much does he charge now?