308 winchester brass life

[rcoody]

For me loose primer pockets are a definitely a sign of a hot load. If you are going to load them that hot then brass is the cost of doing business.

Personally I have been there and done that. Unless it is for some special use (1000yrd targets or long range hunting) I prefer to drop down the load a little. Some guns like them hot though.

I have never had a cracked neck and much of my brass has 20 firings or more on it.

For my .308 hunting rifle I full length resize every time with a 0.015 shoulder bump. My standard load is 44gr varget and a Berger 168gr hybrid hunting.

I also anneal every 5 firings.

I only use Lapua brass.

 

[Bart B]

15 thousandths?

Surely, you forgot a zero. Is it really .0015"?

 

[Bart B]

Wow, obviously your definition of what is written is totally different to mine.
If you READ what I said, which is reducing the case to CLOSE TO SAAMI/CIP specs, is EXACTLY what you just wrote, is FL sizing.

Here's what you first put in print:

FL sizing is reducing the case back to SAAMI/CIP minimum dimension, so the case will fit in ANY chamber, what you are describing is PARTIAL FL sizing, the two are not the same.
I do something similar with my loading for hunting, but I use a body die, then size the necks with either a modified neck die and expander, or a dedicated neck bushing die. It depends on the brass I'm using as to which method I use.
Strangely, contrary to what many believe, my comp rifle cases get Partial FL sizing in a Forster style FL bushing die, are annealed after EVERY firing and get .003" bump to the shoulder.

Compare that to your last remark:

If you READ what I said, which is reducing the case to CLOSE TO SAAMI/CIP specs, is EXACTLY what you just wrote, is FL sizing.

 

[rcoody]

15 thousandths?

Surely, you forgot a zero. Is it really .0015"?

as usual you are right

 

[bigedp51]

The following .308 information is "ball Park" due to many variables. These cases were fired in a new Savage rifle "BUT" the amount of shoulder setback was not given.

Photos from Handloader Magazine

Read the link below for measuring base expansion just above the extractor groove. lightbulb

Simple Trick for Monitoring Pressure of Your Rifle Reloads | Hodgdon Reloading

Bottom line, you are loading too hot, and need to respect your brass more and not abuse it.

 

[bigedp51]

Bart B,
I know you are very knowledgeable, but your definition of what FL sizing is and what you are actually describing, are two very different things.
FL sizing is reducing the case back to SAAMI/CIP minimum dimension, so the case will fit in ANY chamber, what you are describing is PARTIAL FL sizing, the two are not the same.
I do something similar with my loading for hunting, but I use a body die, then size the necks with either a modified neck die and expander, or a dedicated neck bushing die. It depends on the brass I'm using as to which method I use.
Strangely, contrary to what many believe, my comp rifle cases get Partial FL sizing in a Forster style FL bushing die, are annealed after EVERY firing and get .003" bump to the shoulder. Accuracy is better than neck sizing and using a body die separately.
To the OP, if case life is short, you're probably pushing the shoulder back excessively, try adjusting your die OUT, size a case, until it feels snug on bolt closure, then adjust IN 1/12 of a turn, this is approx .003" adjustment.

Cheers.
gun)

Full length resizing is done with a full length resizing die and the die can be adjusted up and down for minimum shoulder bump.

Below your case should be full length resized until the case shoulder is pushed, bumped or setback the desired amount below the red dotted line.

Bottom line, your reloading dies have threads and are adjustable up and down for the correct amount of shoulder setback.

We live in a plus and minus manufacturing world and no two chambers and resisizing dies are the same. I have a Lee .223 die that resizes the base of the case to a smaller diameter than two small base dies I have. This same die will push the shoulder back .009 if the die contacts the shell holder.

"AND" the purpose of a small base die is to size the case to minimum SAAMI dimensions, "BUT" our plus and minus manufacturing world varies.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Been loading 308 win with IMR 4895 seem to get short brass life. Best load is 45.5 gr. with 125 nosler ballistic tip 44.gr with 150 gr. nosler ballistic tip. any body else notice this. 3 or 4 loads brass is junk

I FL resize every time and I get 10-12 reloads without any issues but I resize with no expander ball on the stem and use a bushing die I haven't cracked a neck on a long time and I load many different brass brands..

The rub (so to speak) in brass life comes from overworking the brass so removal of the expander ball only works the brass one way instead of 2 ways.

As a rule, none of my dies has the expander ball on the stem, you don't need it. The pill will expand the neck as it exits (when firing). Why needlessly expand it only to contract it. Far as bump goes, once you initially bump a case, there is little set back on subsequent ignition cycles provided the cartridge is used in the same firearm.

Hope that helps.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Full length resizing is done with a full length resizing die and the die can be adjusted up and down for minimum shoulder bump.

Below your case should be full length resized until the case shoulder is pushed, bumped or setback the desired amount below the red dotted line.

Bottom line, your reloading dies have threads and are adjustable up and down for the correct amount of shoulder setback.

We live in a plus and minus manufacturing world and no two chambers and resisizing dies are the same. I have a Lee .223 die that resizes the base of the case to a smaller diameter than two small base dies I have. This same die will push the shoulder back .009 if the die contacts the shell holder.

"AND" the purpose of a small base die is to size the case to minimum SAAMI dimensions, "BUT" our plus and minus manufacturing world varies.

Not all dies are created equal. Dies like stock RCBS dies are designed and built with a long base that 'cams over' as it contacts the shell holder, that is, unable to achieve a bump condition. The answer is to grind off a couple thousands from the base using a surface grinder. Then the die will bump, but not until the base is shortened.

You can, in lieu of grinding the die base, use shell holders that aren't standard height (Sinclair sells them) that do the same thing. Myself, I prefer grinding the base but then I own a surface grinder.

 

[bigedp51]

Not all dies are created equal. Dies like stock RCBS dies are designed and built with a long base that 'cams over' as it contacts the shell holder, that is, unable to achieve a bump condition. The answer is to grind off a couple thousands from the base using a surface grinder. Then the die will bump, but not until the base is shortened.

You can, in lieu of grinding the die base, use shell holders that aren't standard height (Sinclair sells them) that do the same thing. Myself, I prefer grinding the base but then I own a surface grinder.

Below a fired case from my AR15 carbine.

Below the same case with .003 shoulder bump with a RCBS die on a RCBS Rockchucker press.

To achieve this I used a plus .004 Redding competition shell holder and the press reached camover.

 

[SidecarFlip]

The reduced height shell holder works (as I stated previously), just as well as grinding the die base.

I prefer modifying the die in the case of stock dies. Most bushing dies already have a short base just for bumping.


....never been too fond of 'camming over' any press, even though thats the RCBS preferred method.

You'll get an easier measurement of the shoulder datum if you reverse your setup, with the Hornady anvil on the stationary jaw. Just easier to hold on t

 

[Bart B]

My observations contradict SidecarFlip's comments.

Years ago, I decided to measure my 6 RCBS .308 Win standard full length sizing dies headspace. Yes, die headspace.

Used a GO chamber headspace gauge (1.630") and caliper along with a standard shell holder (.125" height above flat). With the GO gauge in the die and shell holder slipped onto the gauge rim, caliper measured .005" more from die top to shell holder bottom than without that gauge in the die.

Therefore, all 6 die's headspace measured 1.625".

SAAMI minimum .308 Win case headspace is 1.627".

All 6 dies set to stop against the shell holder size fired cases to have 1.626" to 1.627" headspace depending on the case and lubricity it has when sizing down.

Which to me means RCBS "chambered" those dies to set fired case shoulders back to approximate SAAMI specs for case headspace when the die was set to be hard against the shell holder flat at the top (cam over) point of the press operation. All fired cases have their shoulders bumped back with any one of those set for cam over press use.

Several other RCBS full length sizing dies for other rimless bottleneck cartridges had headspace about .005" less than their GO headspace gauge spec.

Called RCBS to ask about it. The said that's how all their full length sizing dies for rimless bottleneck cartridges were made. Same for belted ones.