280AI. Need info

[Plinker147]

280 has been a favorite of mine and when Nosler standardize the 280AI it was a perfect deal for me. I don't like fireforming and I liked stamped brass.
That's made it a reality for me.

For the OP I would go with the Nosler version since Hornady and Nosler make brass and there is some factory ammo available.

Either version is an Excellent choice, it's one the best all around cartridges.

 

[Alibiiv]

I'm thinking that part of your confusion is figuring out the difference between the .280 Remington and the .280 Ackley Improved. In my opinion Nosler made a real mess out of a very good concept of straightening out the walls of the .280 Remington case and changing the shoulder angle from 17`30' on the .280 Remington compared to the shoulder angle to 40` on the .280 Ackley Improved cartridge; and......Nosler shortened the case over-all-length from 2.540 (.280 Rem) to 2.525 on the .280AI. Ackley's concept for improving his cartridges was to USE the parent cartridge in its original dimensions and only change the angles on the outside wall and on the shoulder angle. Although Nosler is calling their cartridge the .280 Ackley Improved, due to the fact that Nosler chose to make their .280 Ackely Improved .025 thousandths shorter than the parent case it is not a true .280 Ackley Improved; and, in my opinion that cartridge ought to be called the Nosler .280 Ackley Improved or simply the .280 Nosler. When J E Custom wrote about the "old chamber" (original Ackley) that is what he has written about. The "new" SAAMI chambering by Nosler is .025 thousandths shorter than the original chambering by Ackley. I too was going to build a .280 Ackley Improved, however I felt that Nosler shortened the original .280 Ackley Improved so they could sell their brass and their ammunition exclusively for that particular cartridge; and, I refuse to be held hostage to their marketing techniques!!! One other factor that you might want to consider and do some research on is to check the availability of the brass and then the cost of that brass???? I have found that brass is not always available and the cost of the brass is quite steep. And...as many "new" designer cartridges as the market for that particular cartridge looses interest the manufacturers seem to loose interest in making that product to manufacture the newer designer cartridge.

With all that said......I agree with many of the replies that you already have an optimal 7mm caliber in your hunting arsenal of firearm, the 7mmRemMag. In my opinion if you reload you can make the 7mmRemMag as versatile as you would like by either loading up or loading down to make the rifle recoil as you would like. Another good reply that you received was to put a good muzzle brake on your rifle to eliminate felt recoil.

Now with all that said, I too wanted to build a .280 Ackley (previously written) however refused to be held hostage to Nosler's marketing tactics!! So........I spited myself and built a .270 Ackley Improved on a Ruger 77 action with a 26 inch Lilja barrel. Read a lot of negative information (quite dated) about how inefficient the cartridge was, yet is was my other choice for my new build. Despite the negative information, it was what "I" wanted to build and that is what I built. Out of the 26 inch barrel I am pushing a 150gr bullet at 3300+fps, and that meets all of my needs for the game intended to hunt at the distances that I want to hunt it at; white tail deer, and hopefully a mule deer/antelope hunt. And.....yes I have to fireform my brass, that can be a PITA at times, but......I built what I wanted to build. I was also told not to use the Ruger 77 action for various reasons, but it was what I wanted as I have a safe full of Ruger 77s, so.....that is what I did the build on!! So....after reading all of this reply and other's on this thread, and you want to build a .280 Ackley Improved by all means that is what you ought to be building!! Good luck with whatever you decide to do and to build.

 

[Fubarredz]

I shoot mine with Berger VLDH 168gr at 2900fps and have shot it all the way out to 800yds no problem. I fire form the Remington 280 brass. To me the Rem brass seems to be more consistent than the nosler brass I use to use.

 

[PonyLady]

I have been shooting a 280 AI benchrest for nearly 8 years. I use Nosler brass and Berger 140gr match bullets. I use IMR 4350 @ 58 gr. The round is routinely over 31k fps and I am 90% @ 850 yds. We used to have a 1000 yd range and the rifle/round were just as accurate at that distance.
I shoot this round because it is flat, fast and accurate and has minimal recoil. I have other benchrest rifles, but this is my favourite.
My rifle is heavy and I wouldn't want to have to carry it for hunting. That being said, I would think with a little research, a hunting rifle in this caliber would be a great gun.

 

[26Reload]

31k fps....holy cow that's a fast round...

 

[Mcarso1]

I was going to turn my 280 into ai awhile back and still may someday but at the time I wanted a new rifle ASAP and gunsmith I was talking to was 6 months out from being able to start mine so I bought a Christensen arms ridgeline in 6.5x284 per the recommendation of smith and I love it. I was looking for a good round that could do deer or elk with as little recoil as possible due to having shoulder surgery. With the brake on it is like shooting a 243.

 

[crystalgayleguy]

280 rem and 280 ai r my to two favorite calibers

 

[Blacktail]

Bigeclipse,
The below article should be of some help to you as far as explaining what Nosler did with the.280AI.
https://faq.nosler.com/index.php?action=artikel&cat=32&id=39&artlang=en
I use Nosler .280AI brass for mine and Redding ".280 Ackley Improved" dies (Type S Match Bushing). Here's a link from Redding explaining the die situation.
https://www.redding-reloading.com/tech-line-a-tips-faqs/133-280-changes

I think a 1-9 twist would serve you well concerning your stated bullet weight range. Mine is a 1-9 and I shoot Berger 168gr vld's with no problems (Savage 110/Criterion barrel).
I'm certainly NO EXPERT, but If you intend this build to only be a "woods hunting rifle" (with no need for a high BC bullet) in my opinion you may want to consider other chamberings better suited for "woods hunting" applications? Good luck, Sir.

I have a 280ai with 26" carbon benchmark tube 700 action with the 1:9. Currently shooting 143 HHs to .5 MOA at at 3180 fps. The smith originally was shooting 168 bergers at 3020 fps. Its been greats thus far as I wanted one lightweight rifle to do it all. It comes in at 7.5 scoped with vortex LH. I have been contemplating trying 160 accubonds 168 bergers or even Eldxs but it shoots the 143 HHs so well plus I leave in commi California so need the lead free bullet. Not sure this helps you at all

 

[257RobertsMan]

I was going to turn my 280 into ai awhile back and still may someday but at the time I wanted a new rifle ASAP and gunsmith I was talking to was 6 months out from being able to start mine so I bought a Christensen arms ridgeline in 6.5x284 per the recommendation of smith and I love it. I was looking for a good round that could do deer or elk with as little recoil as possible due to having shoulder surgery. With the brake on it is like shooting a 243.

I like wise have considered turning my 280 Rem into an Ai. I'm currently running a 140gr NAB at 2,950 for myself and the same bullet at 2,750 (basically 7/08 velocity). Either load is lights out on any whitetail within my self imposed range of 400 +/- yds (can shoot further, but get closer most of the time). The original AI chambering will give you slightly better performance with limited brass work. Original 280 will in most cases give you acceptable accuracy when fired in the 280Ai and your fireforming your 280Ai brass as you shoot. And as stated before by many knowledgeable posts herein, trim to lenth and your done. The 280 or 280Ai is great. Build either and you will be happy with either one. However build what you want, you will be happier with the gun you want to build. If you build a 280Ai and am not happy with it, you can find a second home for it real quick!

 

[Turnbolt53]

Re-read the Nosler FAQ that Deputy819 posted, and figured it was worth posting in it's entirety.

Seems there are quite a few 280AI's out there chambered by shade-tree gunsmiths that need to be reworked for proper headspace per Ackley's .003-.004" crush fit requirement.

From the Nosler link:

There have been many variations of "improved" cartridges over the years, and even several different flavors within the "Ackley" cartridges. The 280 is certainly no exception. When the 280 Ackley Improved was developed and standardized through the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute (SAAMI) by Nosler®, the decision was made to honor Mr. Ackley's original design intent by headspacing the cartridge such that standard 280 Remington ammunition would chamber with slight (.003"/.004") crush at the shoulder/neck intersection and fire form into the Ackley chamber without the need to seat the bullet into the rifling. In fact, Mr. Ackley headspaced his "improved" cartridges by simply grinding a standard "go" headspace gage for the parent cartridge back by 0.004" and using it to headspace the new version. This is also the way that many large custom gun shops have chambered the 280 Ackley for almost 40 years. In order to achieve this, any standard 280 Remington firearm being opened up to the Ackley must have the barrel set back one turn prior to reaming the chamber – simply improving the standard chamber without doing so will yield excessive headspace, even though this was common practice for many gun makers over the years as well. Based on this design, the 280 Ackley Improved was accepted by SAAMI in February of 2008 and has enjoyed tremendous success ever since.

Occasionally, a rifle that was "improved" by simply reaming the chamber without first setting the barrel back will turn up and result in questions about its compatibility with factory ammunition. Unbeknownst to their owner, most of these guns have headspace dimensions of between 0.010" and 0.015" greater than the SAAMI version of the 280 Ackley Improved. These rifles are perfectly functional so long as they are used with ammunition that has been properly formed and sized to fit their chambers. If the customer wishes to use their rifle with modern SAAMI-compliant 280 Ackley ammunition, it must be re-headspaced to properly chamber the ammunition.

 

[Tarheelpwr]

One thing I would look at (I currently am for different round) is a single load that can do both jobs. I ended up with a 150 class Sledge Hammer in my 30/06.

If elk are a realistic target, I would look at this:
https://hammerbullets.com/product/284-cal-150-sledge-hammer/

if they're more of an afterthought, I'd look at this:
https://hammerbullets.com/product/284-cal-136g-sledge-hammer/

That's just food for thought. If you like tinkering and want multiple loads, then carry on

 

[okie man]

Going back to the original post here, the guy wants a flat shooting woods gun shooting 120-140 grain bullets. The standard 280 is all that! For me the gains made by the improvements to that case are very small . The shoulder has been moved forward already. It feeds well from all action types and you don't need a 26-28" barrel to get the performance it delivers!

 

[Coyote_Hunter]

280 rem and 280 ai r my to two favorite calibers

You mean the .280 Rem and .280AI are your favorite "caliber", singular. They are your two favorite "cartridges".

As a 37-year 7mm TRM shooter, i really enjoy my .280 Rem. Burns less ga, has less recoil and does pretty much everything I need with a 140g bullet at 2942fps.