28 nosler

[Longrangec]

I agree on the rl 33 .. I would never ever go by a sigkilo and pay all that money when I can run retumbo

 

[6point5x284]

I ran R33 in a Win Mag for a long time hunting in MT. Load develop and shooting rocks, etc... all summer long can have temps at or over 100. I once hunted in 56 below zero with the wind chill. The velocities absolutely change. While Ryan mentioned it's not a huge drop at 1,000 in a 28 Nosler, keep in mind your accuracy node. In a 100 degree F to even 0 degree F example, it can drop easily 35 fps or more, and in some rifles that bumps you out of your accuracy node. Some nodes are good across a 50 fps band, some more, and some less. I finally had to stop using it as it shot great when very cold and a slower velocity, and shot horrible when above 70 or so as velocity increase pushed it out of it's accuracy node. I switched to H1000 (in my Win Mag) and have been much happier for a true hunting rifle. Im sure this matters a lot to some based off how/where/when you shoot, and not so much to others. But keep in mind your accuracy node. I always hear people say well it's only 25fps. Than can be a big deal if it makes your gun open up from .5 MOA to 1.5 MOA as was the case for me.

 

[maninthemaze]

I sent Alliant an email asking for load data on the 28 Nosler using R26. I also asked about how temp stable the powders were. This is there response. I hope this clears the air a little.....

Eric,
Alliant has three temp stable propellants by their chemistry. These are AR-Comp, Reloder-16 and Reloder-23.* Reloder-26 by its chemistry is not temp stable, but in most applications it behaves much like a temp stable propellant.* The Reloder-33 is not at temp stable propellant. That being said, all of our propellants need to pass, by lot, testing procedures in a wide range of temperatures, wider than any self-respecting human would be hunting or shooting under.
As for load data for the 28 Nosler, Alliant has no tested load data for this cartridge at this time.
I will submit your request to the engineering lab for possible future development. But, there is no timetable as to when this may be looked at for development.
Thanks,
Duane V.
Technical Services Rep
Alliant/Blazer/CCI/Speer

 

[WildRose]

I got what your saying, and sure hope to not ever have the need to shoot in anything in excess of 80 deg. For the most part I do most all of my load development and range verification between at no more than 50 deg. and try to keep it around 30 so things are as close to a day of typical hunting as possible. I really don't care to have two separate loads for different temps if it comes to that I'll just run Retumbo and live with 100fps less velocity.

You're getting some pretty good advice above.

I'd add this, you probably won't get good results with RL33 unless you're pushing 180gr bullets or heavier.

So far in the three calibers I've used it on it's best utility is with the heavy for caliber bullets.

RL23 and RL26 do better with the mid weight bullets giving surprisingly high velocities and low ES.

As a general rule I like to do my load development in temps slightly warmer than I plan to be hunting in, that way if there is going to be a pressure issue I want to see it before I get into a critical situation.

Temperatures here can swing easily by a hundred degrees through the course of the year so it's always interesting. If I'm seeing any pressure signs at all during load development in the spring or summer I back off a good bit.

H1000 is another very good powder for cases of this volume.

 

[breakshntr]

Yeah 195's or maybe a 180 grain for me in the 28 Nosler as mine is being throated for the 195. Anything lighter with a properly thought out over-bore gun is a waist of chaimbering and un-burnt powder if you ask me. Never could understand why people would insist on getting the hottest cartridge and want to shoot little lightweight bullets. Like a 300 ultra mag running 150 grain bullets or 40 grain bullets out of a 220 swift. I'm hoping that when my 28 gets done that I can find a good wide band for an accuracy node and like said load things on the bottom end of the node so as to give me safe loads in a wide range. If a different set of data needs to be ran on my Sig 2400 so be it. Or start using up all this Retumbo.

 

[WildRose]

Yeah 195's or maybe a 180 grain for me in the 28 Nosler as mine is being throated for the 195. Anything lighter with a properly thought out over-bore gun is a waist of chaimbering and un-burnt powder if you ask me. Never could understand why people would insist on getting the hottest cartridge and want to shoot little lightweight bullets. Like a 300 ultra mag running 150 grain bullets or 40 grain bullets out of a 220 swift. I'm hoping that when my 28 gets done that I can find a good wide band for an accuracy node and like said load things on the bottom end of the node so as to give me safe loads in a wide range. If a different set of data needs to be ran on my Sig 2400 so be it. Or start using up all this Retumbo.

Use the right powder with light bullets and it's not a problem. Lighter bullets, faster powders, Heavier, particularly at the high end of weight for a given caliber use slower powders and you can get great results.

For a lot of people it's all about finding a load with more manageable recoil for a wife, girlfriend, child etc until they can "grow" into being the kind of disciplined shooter for whom recoil sensitivity is not a problem.

For a lot of varmint hunters it's all about speed, speed,and when they run out of those, more speed.

Shooting coyotes or hogs running full tilt at 400-600 yards has a whole new set of complications that are never an issue when shooting stationary targets at much further ranges.

Different pills to solve different ills.

 

[breakshntr]

From a manageable recoil stand point I can sure see a valid point, though somewhat of a waist of caliber potential. After all when a critter is laying down dead in the dirt its hard to wish you killed them even deader.
Anyway back on track a bit. I emailed Berger last night about load data specifically for their 195 EOL. Was hoping that the had done some messing around with longer throated 28 Nosler and would pass on some data, but as I figured they promptly got back to me and gave me their load data. Loaded to SAMMI specs understandably.
From Berger for what its worth.

 

[breakshntr]

28 Nosler 195 Berger EOL, 3.499" COAL, 26" Barrel

Bullet Powder Start Load velocity Max Load velocity %Density
195 RE25 69 2733 72.9 2861 92
195 RE33 79.5 2798 83.7 2959 96
195 RE50 82.5 2777 87.1 2957 101
195 H1000 71.5 2733 75.5 2876 96
195 Retumbo 75 2784 78.8 2913 99
195 US869 83.5 2728 87.8 2891 104
195 H50bmg 79.5 2724 83.9 2900 104

 

[stx]

Tagging in....

 

[Levi]

I'm having a 28 nosler built also. I have been back and forth between reloader 33 and retumbo. Living in Idaho my temp swings are not real large in the areas I hunt. I'm guessing if I did load development at say 40 degrees I would not see much of a POI change out to 1,000 if the temps ranged from 20-60 degrees, but I may be wrong. Reloader 33 seems to be the clear winner, based on my research, with the 195 and I am excited to give it a go.

Levi

 

[Engineering101]

Levi

I've been using RL-33 for several years now hunting in the Northwest including Montana where it gets pretty cold and I think what you describe will work fine. I develop loads this time of year (it is 39 degrees right now) and that is in the ball park of temps you see around here during hunting season. As you suggested, a 40 degree range should be OK. Do test for temp drift to see what your load does in your rifle. Then you will know when you are out of bounds of that ballpark

As to performance, nothing out there beats the powders Alliant imports from Nitrochemie. I'm using them all including RL-50 in my 264 WSM. RL-26 is really impressive in my 270 WSM, 7mm WSM and 300 WSM too and for that matter also in my 30-06. I have started to play with RL-23 just in case I need a really stable powder. It will cost you 100 fps but is supposed to be rock solid when exposed to temperature extremes. It of course is made by Bofors and uses a completely different technology.

By the way, I love my 28 Nosler. It is basically a better behaved version of the 7mm RUM.

 

[cjuve]

Oh alright .. with .280 Free bore what was your coal with the 195

I just checked COAL and it varies from 3.742-3.745 but all are 3.990 with a Hornady gauge. I am sitting as close to .020 jump as I could measure.

 

[cjuve]

Just started load development with my 28 nosler and Retumbo
As stated before this is a long throat version so these loads are not suggested for a standard rifle throat configuration.

195 Berger EOL
CCI 250 primer
Retumbo
26" Brux barrel
.280 freebore
Coal = 3.740 +/- .020 jump
Magneto speed

75 gr - 2906 FPS
76 gr - 2934 FPS
77 gr- 2920 FPS. Delayed ignition
78 gr - 3007 FPS highest shot on target
79 gr - 3065 FPS 79,80,81 formed .520" group
80 gr - 3077 FPS 80 and 81 went into same hole
81 gr - 3112 FPS
81.5 - 3137 FPS bolt was a little stiffer extraction was easy
82 gr - 3136 FPS bolt was stiffer yet 1/2" lower POI
82.5 - did not shoot

I am going to load from 79.0 - 80.5 and compare POI looks like there may be a pretty good node there with decent velocities.

 

[Longrangec]

Thanks cjuve .. My smith is building mine to 3.73 coal to the lands so I should be very close to the same as you .. My barrel is 30 inches long so I should get 3175 or so easy with retumbo it looks like .