.17 cal remington centerfire

[Darryl Cassel]

JS

From what I have read and heard from my friend in Alaska, the 17/225 will propel the 30 gr at 4100 to 4300 FPS or a bit faster.
I believe he said he now gets 4100 from his 17 VLR which is a 223 case improved.

He has made some amazing kills with that 17 VLR.

Barrel life?


Later
DC

 

[brianwinzor]

Since 1972, I have been using rifles chambered for a .17/222 magnum improved with 40 degree shoulder. This case has capacity of about 31.5 grains of water, which is similar to that of a .17/223 improved, and about 0.5 - 1.0 grains less than a .17 PPC.

During the last 3 years I have switched to using the 30 grain bullet, and found that this case will achieve 4100- 4175 fps with that bullet weight. This is similar to that being achieved by others using the .17/223 improved, and .17 PPC. The .17 BR seems to achieve about 75 to 100 fps more.

I also chronographed the Berger 37 grain VLD (BC.343) to find out what velocity could be achieved with this case. I achieved 3785 fps using a full case (30.0 grains) of WIN 785, however as expected the bullet keyholed into the target, as it requires a 1 in 7 twist barrel to stabilise it.

However, some are having problems getting the Berger 37 grain VLD to hold together and be accurate at velocities in excess of 3500 -3600 fps. About 3 years ago, Walt Berger in replying to my query on this issue, told me that he thought 3450 fps was the practical limit for the bullet.

I believe that cases with a capacity of about 31 to 33 grains are the practical limit when using the 30 grain bullet.

A case such as the .17/225, would only be practical if suitable bullets in the 35 to 40 grain range could be sourced. Hope the above helps your choice. Good luck, Brian

 

[Darryl Cassel]

Brian

What is the barrel length of your 17? It will make a difference in velocity.

later
DC

 

[brianwinzor]

Darryl,
Originally when new in 1986, it was 25.25 inches, and about 6 months ago I had the barrel set back and rechambered for the same case, and lost about 0.6 inches in the process.(ie 24.6)

I had this done as the throat had eroded about .250 inches after about 1600 shots, velocity was down about 100 fps, and my gunsmith was available to do the job.

In my .17/222 mag imp, with the 30 grain bullet, about 27.0 - 28.0 grains of H414, or Viht N550 will achieve between 4050 - 4175 fps. I use this rifle as a principly a varmint rifle for foxes, rabbits, etc and did not want the length to exceed 26 inches.

However, it would be interesting to see what velocity increase would occur with a 27 or 28 inch barrel. Good luck, Brian.

 

[Darryl Cassel]

I was thinking on the lines of a 30" barrel.

That would be interesting.

later
DC

 

[brianwinzor]

Darryl,
My only experience with a long barrel, was in 1972, when I put a 33 inch Ackley Barrel on a 22/284. The rifle achieved 4,048 fps using 54.0 grains Norma 205 with the 60 grain Hornady Hp. Unfortunately, there were no suitable bullets heavier than that available in Australia at that time.

I recently had the 25.25 inch barrel chambered for the .224 Clark (64 grain capacity, same as 22/284) set back after 1500 shots and rechambered to 22/250AI.

The 224 Clark achieved 4,035 fps (55.5 IMR 7828) with the 60 grain Nosler SPBT, 3,952 fps (54.5 IMR 7828) with 69 grain Sierra HPBT, 3735 fps (57.0 H1000) with 80 grain Sierra HPBT.

I intend to build up another rifle using the .224 Clark, but next time will use a long action Rem 700, probably a 28 inch barrel, and concentrate on bullets of 80 grains and heavier. Good luck, Brian.

 

[Darryl Cassel]

I have a 22/284 with a 30" barrel and with the 8 twist just made for the 80 gr bullets.

I like my barrels to be at least 30" long and 36 to 37" is even better in some of the big stuff I have.

The 80 gr bullets from the 22/284 will Penetrate (all the way through) 6" hardwood bowling pins at 1000 yards quite easy.

I may put together another 17 only with a 30" barrel. Maybe the 17 VLR?

Good Shooting to you.
DC

 

[chris matthews]

Hey Darryl,
Wouldn't your 22-284 be able to get by with a little slower twist than the 8" since it's going so fast? 1-8 is for 223ish.
Not saying its a bad thing just kinda thinkin out loud. Which leads me to a 17 PPC, Tooley stock, Nesika action, I don't know, seems like a hellacious doggin rig!

 

[Tim Behle]

DC,

I have a 27" barrel on my 17 Remington. I push the 25 grain Berger Match bullets at 4315 with 25.2 grains of IMR 4320.

I've pushed the little 15 grain Bergers over 5,000 FPS but not for far. About 150-175 yards the little bullets went *Poof*

 

[sscoyote]

Just a little more here. I've been using a couple factory 17's for about 10 years or so now on coyotes and love 'em. I also have a 17" Shilen .17 Mach IV XP-100. I was using Todd Kindler's 29 BTHP, and found it to be a good performer on coyotes to about 300+. DC-- i saw that guy you're talking about on the cover of Small Caliber News-- right?? Big bearded guy-- bigger than the wolf he's holding up-- right?? And that guy shooting @ 1000 was Corbin Shell-- I made copies of the PS article and sent it to my Small Caliber friends. Of all the stuff i've seen/heard over the years though, i believe one of the most experienced .17 cal. shooters has got to be Blaine Eddy out of Clearfield, UT. He is an accuracy/velocity .17 cal. nut, and kills right around 100 coyotes/season with 'em. He's used all kinds of .17's-- right now he's working on a short BR case, but was shooting a shortened PPC case last season he called the .17DT. A little more on bullets-- Blaine was telling me the 30 gr. Gold from Todd Kindler (SCN editor) is the highest B.C. 17 cal. bullet (besides the big Berger), and it supposedly shoots flatter to 500 than any other of equivalent wt., he's currently using some of the Genco's now-- they're supposed to have a website somewhere. Anybody that's seriously interested in the .17's ought to give Eddy a call. That guy's got a world of 17 bullet/case experience. He's in the book.


Hey Brian-- what koind of accuracy were you getting out of that .222 Mag. case??

[ 01-21-2004: Message edited by: sscoyote ]

[ 01-21-2004: Message edited by: sscoyote ]

 

[brianwinzor]

SSCoyote,
I used the 25 grain Hornady HP in the .17/222 mag imp. from 1986 to 1997.

I first tested the 30 grain bullet in 1997 when it became available in Australia, and in about 2002 bought a supply of the 30 grain Hammett HPBT. About 2 weeks ago I tested the Kindler 30 grain Gold which you referred to.

The 25 grain Hornady Hp produced numerous groups of less than .4 moa, with several under .2, and this was with my field load of 30 grains of H414 which produced 4380 to 4503 fps depending on temperature.

I never got to do the full case preparation routine to try for the ultra small group, as I am happy with sub .5moa in my field loads which have a minimum of case preparation.

The 30 grain Berger HP gave several groups under .5 moa, but only if velocity did not exceed about 3,700 fps. At 4,100 fps they would not reach the 100 yard target.

The 30 grain Hammett HPBT has given some groups under .5 moa, but I have been getting some fliers. However, I first started testing them when the barrel had fired 1400 shots and the throat eroded .250 inches.

Since the barrel was set back, rechambered, and rebedded about 6 months ago, I have been regularly getting 2 shots touching and a flier. I hope to sort out that problem in the coming weekend.

I have only fired 3 groups with the Kindler 30 grain Gold and they all were between .7 and .9 moa. As I am using a 1 in 10 twist barrel, this probably wasn't a bad result, as many find they need a 1 in 9 twist barrel to stabilise them.

Hope the above information helps. Good luck, Brian.

 

[Tim Behle]

Sscoyote,

Didn't Blaine switch over to using a .14 caliber for his coyotes a couple of years ago? Or am I thinking of someone else?

Tim

 

[Darryl Cassel]

SSCoyote

The fellow you mentioned on the cover is a friend of mine and the person I mentioned.

He could fill a magazine with some of the experiances he has had in Alaska. He likes his 17 VLR, his 224 Clark and the 6.5/300 Weatherby and has killed "Many" 100s of critters with them over the years. Some of the ranges he kills are very long.

He also sent me some of the 30 Gr Golds and I have yet to try them out to any degree.

Later
DC

 

[brianwinzor]

Darryl,
I am curious which 80 grain bullet you used to penetrate the bowling balls at 1000 yards, and also which bullets of 80 grains and heavier that you have tested.

I still have my 22/284 formed cases and dies, as the thief who stole the rifle including BV Unertl 16/20 scope, and the rest of my arsenal in 1983, predictably had no interest in the cases and dies.

As the Clark has proven a success, next time around I may have another go at the 22/284, as I still have a good supply of H870 that I don't want to go stale. Good luck, Brian