Oh and the NOS ABLR's have been the easiest, most accurate and better performing on game of the three! Use them in my 7 STW and 30-378 also!
142 ABLR vs 143 ELD-x vs 140 Elite Hunter
- Thread starter Greasegun
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25WSM
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You spelled Shepherd right.
Shep
Shep
keithcandler
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Grease gun, your choice of primer is killing you. Your thinking is correct in thick cup primers, but you need a hot primer, which the cci 400 and cci 41 are not.
Use the 450 and 7 1/2 and see what happens with your groups. You also may find better accuracy with a large rifle primer.
If you need to have your bolt bused to stop cratering, then it is around $85 for the fix.
I usually work with a single bullet and powder, then move on to another bullet...makes things simpler.
Wind at your range maybe an issue. I draw arrows on the target to show the wind direction for that day. Keeping groups to 1/2 moa when the wind is switching around is tough to impossible....without at least a couple of wind flags out.
Use the 450 and 7 1/2 and see what happens with your groups. You also may find better accuracy with a large rifle primer.
If you need to have your bolt bused to stop cratering, then it is around $85 for the fix.
I usually work with a single bullet and powder, then move on to another bullet...makes things simpler.
Wind at your range maybe an issue. I draw arrows on the target to show the wind direction for that day. Keeping groups to 1/2 moa when the wind is switching around is tough to impossible....without at least a couple of wind flags out.
JarHeadTim
Well-Known Member
ON THE PRIMER SUBJECT, if you haven't seen this its illuminating...
http://www.targetshooter.co.uk/?p=1471
http://www.targetshooter.co.uk/?p=1471
brentc
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Agreed. I use the same Base to Ogive measurement for the 143 ELD-X an the 140 EH with excellent results. Both are in the sweet spot at right around .050" off.
Lonehunter
Active Member
I have worked up loads for several 6.5CM and they all shot 1/4" or less at 100yards and 3/4or less at 300yards. Load for all were:
Powder- H4350
Charge- 42.0-42.5 gr.
Bullet: Horn. 143ELDX
*Note: adjust seating depth to lands. Some shot touching and some were around five thousands off.
Hope this helps.
keithcandler
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*Note: adjust seating depth to lands. Some shot touching and some were around five thousandths off.
No truer words ever spoken! For this reason, many rifles are at their best shot as a single shot or a two shot.
Wyatt's mag box will fix some of this issue adding .120 to available OAL.
I expect groups in the 2's, three shot, repeat several times after barrel cools.
Simple wind flags are worth their weight in gold, and most are too hard headed to use them. Wind is not a constant, it picks up, switches, dies down. When you can read these simple changes, your groups shrink tremendously. Then you wonder, "where the hell have I been all these years?"
6.5 Cred with .199 freebore is on the ragged edge of being too long with the use of a vld bullet with magazine max OAL in medium length actions. So, you play with jumping the bullet to make best use of a bad situation. ON the next custom build, have .129 freebore reamer used instead of a .199 is one fix. The other fixes are to a long action on the next build with plenty of mag room to chase the leade as it grows, or go to a 6.5x47 Lapua which is a shorter cartridge.
Some rifles will shoot well jumping, some will NOT, PERIOD. You are forced to seat to maximum magazine OAL, and work up the best load for that spot. As you shoot, leade will increase to a point to where accuracy with that bullet will not be attained. At that point, going to a bullet like a Sierra 140g btsp will give you accuracy, but you will loose BC....pick your poison.
In my 6.5 creeds, the 143 eld x likes to touch the lands for the smallest groups that are bug holes. 140g Hornady bthp likes to touch the lands. 140g berger VLD hunting likes .010 off. 123g and 140g Sierra match like to touch the lands. 120 and 140g Sierra Pro Hunters have a wide range of OAL's that shoot small groups, and these two bullets are not of a VLD design.
On a custom build, design for success way down the road, not just when the barrel is new. Rem long actions and Tikka's have plenty of extra room to play with. The weight difference between a short and long action Rem build is about 6 oz.
When my barrels are shooting 5/8"-3/4" at 100, it is time for a new barrel or a barrel set back to get the bullet closer to the lands....not a small consideration.
Accuracy is a relative thing from individual to individual. You can work up acceptable loads to hunt with jumping the bullets, but it is a fickle bitch to deal with over time, especially with VLD bullets. Berger has come out with a Classic line of bullet that helps tremendously with this issue, more bearing surface, less VLD. If you have not tried any of the Berger Classic bullets, I suggest that you try some during the Holiday sales...you are in for real treat when it comes to small groups and tuning a load for best OAL.
No truer words ever spoken! For this reason, many rifles are at their best shot as a single shot or a two shot.
Wyatt's mag box will fix some of this issue adding .120 to available OAL.
I expect groups in the 2's, three shot, repeat several times after barrel cools.
Simple wind flags are worth their weight in gold, and most are too hard headed to use them. Wind is not a constant, it picks up, switches, dies down. When you can read these simple changes, your groups shrink tremendously. Then you wonder, "where the hell have I been all these years?"
6.5 Cred with .199 freebore is on the ragged edge of being too long with the use of a vld bullet with magazine max OAL in medium length actions. So, you play with jumping the bullet to make best use of a bad situation. ON the next custom build, have .129 freebore reamer used instead of a .199 is one fix. The other fixes are to a long action on the next build with plenty of mag room to chase the leade as it grows, or go to a 6.5x47 Lapua which is a shorter cartridge.
Some rifles will shoot well jumping, some will NOT, PERIOD. You are forced to seat to maximum magazine OAL, and work up the best load for that spot. As you shoot, leade will increase to a point to where accuracy with that bullet will not be attained. At that point, going to a bullet like a Sierra 140g btsp will give you accuracy, but you will loose BC....pick your poison.
In my 6.5 creeds, the 143 eld x likes to touch the lands for the smallest groups that are bug holes. 140g Hornady bthp likes to touch the lands. 140g berger VLD hunting likes .010 off. 123g and 140g Sierra match like to touch the lands. 120 and 140g Sierra Pro Hunters have a wide range of OAL's that shoot small groups, and these two bullets are not of a VLD design.
On a custom build, design for success way down the road, not just when the barrel is new. Rem long actions and Tikka's have plenty of extra room to play with. The weight difference between a short and long action Rem build is about 6 oz.
When my barrels are shooting 5/8"-3/4" at 100, it is time for a new barrel or a barrel set back to get the bullet closer to the lands....not a small consideration.
Accuracy is a relative thing from individual to individual. You can work up acceptable loads to hunt with jumping the bullets, but it is a fickle bitch to deal with over time, especially with VLD bullets. Berger has come out with a Classic line of bullet that helps tremendously with this issue, more bearing surface, less VLD. If you have not tried any of the Berger Classic bullets, I suggest that you try some during the Holiday sales...you are in for real treat when it comes to small groups and tuning a load for best OAL.
Last edited:
stljc2
Well-Known Member
Hi Greasegun,
Well the 140 gr Berger Elite Hunters worked really well in my 260 Rem. Ya might give them a try. I was utilizing V V N550 and WLR primers in Lapua brass. Also..WELCOME. 3 shots 2760 ish ft/s @ 100. Only problem is the 20 thou off the lands makes it to long for the mag well,
PNWdude67
Well-Known Member
I second on trying a different primer and would recommend CCI 450 highly. Also, don't get overly obsessed with your 100 yard groups. Yes, it's a huge confidence boost to have a bug hole 5 shot group, but it's not always the load or the barrel harmonics that blow a .3 group to .9.... we are only human after all. The harder I try for that tiny group on paper the more it evades me. take your best group that has lowest ES and (If you can), hang a plate at 600 and find your load that hits that plate 5/5. You'll probably find a sub .5 load that will be your huckleberry.
johnnyk
Well-Known Member
"Simple wind flags are worth their weight in gold, and most are too hard headed to use them. Wind is not a constant, it picks up, switches, dies down. When you can read these simple changes, your groups shrink tremendously. Then you wonder, "where the hell have I been all these years?""
Amen brother, so true!
Amen brother, so true!
Tikkashooter
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- 64
147 ELD-M, better accuracy and BC than the above bullets and kills just as fast or even better
25WSM
Well-Known Member
tangodown
Well-Known Member
Ronald W Schaefer
Well-Known Member
My son and business partner both have CT Carbon Edge Fierce Rifles in 6.5 Creed. They both use RL-17 powder, my son gets about .5 MOA at 2720 fps using 41.5 grs RL-17, Lapua brass, CCI BR-2 and 142 Nosler Accubond (20"Bbl). He shoots about 100+ deer a year as ranch manger and wildlife biologist (Culling and harvest plans on big ranches) and says the Accubond is very deadly on WT deer--usually DRT 1 shot kills. He has no love for the 143 ELD-X and hasn't used the Berger much on game but said its seems to be a pretty good killer as well...just went through a period where we couldn't get 'em (the Bergs) so developed his best load with Nos ABLRs.
