I see some of these ultra setups today that the arrows kick or loop off the bow and guys hunt with them like that. Blows my mind. I guess they just don't know any better but that can cause allota bad things to happen on impact. I guess I'm stuck in my ways but I'm very partial to feathers. I shoot a lot of 5.5" Maxi fletch feathers and actually cut my wild Turkey feathers to match that profile. I'm also a big believer in bare shaft tuning. Every little bit helps
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What effects blood trails more, BH selection or shot implementation?
- Thread starter sdakotaguy
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Doghunter23
Well-Known Member
I agree totally- single bevel two blade designs with out penetrate any other possible option. They are time tested and extremely durable. If I shot a compound they would be my first go to. They are also known for blowing through bone if a shot goes awry.
I have my oldest boy set up with grizzlies. He has low poundage and short draw length so penetration is critical.
The only problem is it's very difficult to tune a crossbow. Crossbow bolts are comparatively very short and prone to being steered by the front of the arrow. I have not found a fixed blade that would fly out of a crossbow consistently past 340fps. This forces me to use expandables.
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Doghunter23
Well-Known Member
You are correct in regards to arrow direction. But what happened I am willing to bet is what's called arrow redirection. The blades deployed on the rage and due to the aggressive blade angle it acted like a ramp and changed arrow direction slicing the side open. There is tons of video of this happening online if you care to do some checking.I am not incorrect.
A wound that large and that long tells me less than 10 yds and most likely 5 if not straight down.
Green arrow is your arrow direction.
Doghunter23
Well-Known Member
That's all I can do! Shooting one of those newer Ten point crossbows. They say right in the manual you have to shoot their bolts. These bolts are very stiff and I don't know if it's possible for them to flex. Plus its not like you can adjust knock or rest position. The only thing you could even do would be to twist the string.
sdakotaguy
Well-Known Member
Shoot them through paper 1st & if you see anything concerning give customer service a call & see if they may share any insight.
Doghunter23
Well-Known Member
My ten point hold about a 3 inch group at 70 yards with a broad head. I don't think they can help much more. I just resigned myself to the fact that I have to shoot mechanicals long ago. I shoot right close to 450FPS. Thing is closer to a string rifle than a bow!
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I'm not much help on the subject I just like flapping my gums up and down. So here is my story I'm 16 years old and have my 1st bow and bought my 1st car. My dad has property in a gated community for recreational and hunting use. I get off work and drive a lot faster than the Utah H.P. thinks is safe and issues my first ticket for speeding.
Seriously I was probably only doing 65 mph down hill in a 55 mph highway zone, this is when the I just can't drive 55 was still relevant for all you van Halen people. I didn't say fans for goodness sakes calm down already I'm getting to the good part.
Anywho I get thru the gate and start to drive the 2 miles of dirt road up to my dad's place when I spot deer.
Well at 16 it's kinda like getting to second base on a date so I'm not thinking of anything else but killing a deer.
I park the car about 300 yards or so and sneak back around .
Long story short I'm shooting a pse fire flight 2 and muzzy 125 gr broadheads, I'm with in about 45 yrds and let it fly on a big doe as my tag was good for either sex at the time.
I hit her but couldn't really tell where so I sat there for a lot less time then I should have and started to track blood. I lost blood after about 30 minutes of tracking.
I went back and forth for probably a hour until I gave up and went up the hill to a neighbor's that my father was good friends with and told him I could use some help.
Well he gets on the 4 Wheeler and ends up with me showing him the last place of blood.
For the next 2-3 hours we beat the hell out of the brush and finally found it under the a sagebrush no taller than my knees that we went past at least 6 time's.
The arrow went a little to far back hit 1 lung and intestines and only left about 30 yards of blood. Never hit bone clean through but very little blood loss.
The neighbor lost his prescription glass helping me gut and clean the deer.
I don't think he ever forgave me for that night he was a good old boy but brought it ever chance he had.
RIP. you ornery old coot.
Think I'll tip one back for you. Cheers
Seriously I was probably only doing 65 mph down hill in a 55 mph highway zone, this is when the I just can't drive 55 was still relevant for all you van Halen people. I didn't say fans for goodness sakes calm down already I'm getting to the good part.
Anywho I get thru the gate and start to drive the 2 miles of dirt road up to my dad's place when I spot deer.
Well at 16 it's kinda like getting to second base on a date so I'm not thinking of anything else but killing a deer.
I park the car about 300 yards or so and sneak back around .
Long story short I'm shooting a pse fire flight 2 and muzzy 125 gr broadheads, I'm with in about 45 yrds and let it fly on a big doe as my tag was good for either sex at the time.
I hit her but couldn't really tell where so I sat there for a lot less time then I should have and started to track blood. I lost blood after about 30 minutes of tracking.
I went back and forth for probably a hour until I gave up and went up the hill to a neighbor's that my father was good friends with and told him I could use some help.
Well he gets on the 4 Wheeler and ends up with me showing him the last place of blood.
For the next 2-3 hours we beat the hell out of the brush and finally found it under the a sagebrush no taller than my knees that we went past at least 6 time's.
The arrow went a little to far back hit 1 lung and intestines and only left about 30 yards of blood. Never hit bone clean through but very little blood loss.
The neighbor lost his prescription glass helping me gut and clean the deer.
I don't think he ever forgave me for that night he was a good old boy but brought it ever chance he had.
RIP. you ornery old coot.
Think I'll tip one back for you. Cheers
Was it Dr. Ashby that did all of the penetration reports and studies over in Africa years ago? My memory fails me on his name but he was a major champion of the Grizzley head and what it will do. They penetrate big time and the single bevel torque combined with their tip works extremely well on bone. I had good luck with them.
If I hunted in a bit more open terrain for trailing I likely would have used them a lot more. Trailing here often involves wading, swimming, and/or crawling through almost impenetrable briars. I opted for a bit more cutting capacity and the potential to leave a bit larger hole at exit with the 4 blade Zwickey. Someone may actually offer these now but I would like to see a Grizzley with a small pair of fixed, swept back bleeders around .75" in cutting width. The bleeders could be single bevel as well if preferred. I personally believe this would make a good head even that much better. I cannot get a single bevel head as sharp as I like without lightly hitting the back side a couple of strokes with a file. I like a head to be shaving sharp and I sharpen with a Grobet file and coarse diamond stone.
A lifetime ago I hunted quite a bit with my roommate at Clemson. He was shooting an 80# Browning compound, 2419 aluminum arrows, and 200+ grain Simmons Tree Shark broadheads with a 2" plus cutting diameter. I usually shot my 90# PSE and Zwickey 4 blades with 2317 arrows. We both believed in heavy setups. Maybe a bit to heavy but we had penetration potential for sure. Anyway, he stuck a 6 point one afternoon. The shot was textbook broadside and absolutely perfect. The arrow passed right thru. There was decent blood on the arrow and some hair right where the deer was standing. We didn't find another drop of blood for 20 yards and ended up tracking mostly by tracks. We finally found the deer around 90 yards away and I don't think we found 10 drops of blood total. The hit was just like my roommate described. Perfect. Crease in, lower crease out. My thoughts were how in the world does a 2" plus wide head not leave a blood trail better than that with that placement. Later when I got a minute I looked in his quiver. Honest truth here. My lawnmower blades in general are sharper than anything i found in his quiver. Turns out he was terrible at sharpening anything. This little incident has always reinforced the fact for me that broadheads need to be as sharp as you can get them. Preferably shaving sharp. If they are dull and you can't sharpen them, find someone who can. It makes a difference.
If I hunted in a bit more open terrain for trailing I likely would have used them a lot more. Trailing here often involves wading, swimming, and/or crawling through almost impenetrable briars. I opted for a bit more cutting capacity and the potential to leave a bit larger hole at exit with the 4 blade Zwickey. Someone may actually offer these now but I would like to see a Grizzley with a small pair of fixed, swept back bleeders around .75" in cutting width. The bleeders could be single bevel as well if preferred. I personally believe this would make a good head even that much better. I cannot get a single bevel head as sharp as I like without lightly hitting the back side a couple of strokes with a file. I like a head to be shaving sharp and I sharpen with a Grobet file and coarse diamond stone.
A lifetime ago I hunted quite a bit with my roommate at Clemson. He was shooting an 80# Browning compound, 2419 aluminum arrows, and 200+ grain Simmons Tree Shark broadheads with a 2" plus cutting diameter. I usually shot my 90# PSE and Zwickey 4 blades with 2317 arrows. We both believed in heavy setups. Maybe a bit to heavy but we had penetration potential for sure. Anyway, he stuck a 6 point one afternoon. The shot was textbook broadside and absolutely perfect. The arrow passed right thru. There was decent blood on the arrow and some hair right where the deer was standing. We didn't find another drop of blood for 20 yards and ended up tracking mostly by tracks. We finally found the deer around 90 yards away and I don't think we found 10 drops of blood total. The hit was just like my roommate described. Perfect. Crease in, lower crease out. My thoughts were how in the world does a 2" plus wide head not leave a blood trail better than that with that placement. Later when I got a minute I looked in his quiver. Honest truth here. My lawnmower blades in general are sharper than anything i found in his quiver. Turns out he was terrible at sharpening anything. This little incident has always reinforced the fact for me that broadheads need to be as sharp as you can get them. Preferably shaving sharp. If they are dull and you can't sharpen them, find someone who can. It makes a difference.
Prairie Sasquatch
Well-Known Member
I think shot placement trumps broadhead type when it comes to blood trails. Low on the cavity hits and exits leave a lot more blood than high entrance exit wounds. I've had double lung deer go 40 yards and one buck went 457 yards. Adrenaline fueled bucks that are rutting can go a long way even though they should be dead.
Yes but regardless of the placement which creates more blood spill? A slice or a hole?
Prairie Sasquatch
Well-Known Member
My post was referencing broad heads which I would consider anything that slices vs a target or field point. I don't think a field point should ever be used for big game.
I've used a bunch of different broadheads both fixed and mechanical. For deer all I shoot now are razor sharp (which I sharpen) G5 Montecs which are three blade and for elk or moose I shoot a heavier arrow with a fixed 2-blade as I think they penetrate better. I'm partial to Magnus Stingers.
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We are talking about BROADHEADS not field points here. A 2 blade creates a slice. A 3 or 4 blade creates more of a hole. Which one in your opinion if a perfect shot is made, will create the best bloodtrail? It's a simple concept.
Prairie Sasquatch
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry I posted at all. Carry on.
No need to be sorry. I think your experience is valid I'm just wondering what you see gives better blood trails. It's important to the OP. There are many accounts of 2 blades throwing little to no blood at all because the wound can close up where a 4 blade dumps blood no matter what.
