Reloading 300 WSM

EE_Reloader said:

The only issue is I am getting 0.015" of shoulder bump. I normally like 3 to 5 thousandths as this is a hunting rifle and don't want chambering issue. This seems like too much shoulder bump; I've never bumped this much. My question is what can I do to decrease the bump, have the die machined and removed some material or buy a different die? Any suggestions?

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I do not want to misconstrue your statement above. You said you were getting a .0015" shoulder bump, and you would like a .003" - .005" bump. To me, this means you need to increase the bump from .0015" to .003" - .005." In #24, you said the 1.082 base-to-shoulder junction dimension is .008" longer. I still think this is your issue. I had a couple that was .005", and they would not feed until I bumped the shoulder until it chambered properly. Below is my .338 Thor and 1 out of 20 got away from me when loading after hydraulic forming. The one on the right will not chamber because it is .0125" longer.





Did you watch the video I provided you in #11? It addresses this issue. It is only a 7-minute video but is full of pertinent information. We can only advise, but what you do with our information is entirely up to you. Good luck!

You would think but below is how Redding describes them. I was hoping I could set it up to just size the body, but it doesn't look likes it's gonna work like I want it.

"Body Dies are designed to full length resize the case body, bump the shoulder position for proper chambering, but not size the neck at all. They are made without internal parts and are intended for resizing cases which have become increasingly difficult to chamber after repeated firing."

@FEENIX, I am getting 15 thousandths, .015". I only want 3 to 5 thousandths, .003" to .005"

EE_Reloader said:

@FEENIX, I am getting 15 thousandths, .015". I only want 3 to 5 thousandths, .003" to .005"

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I'm sorry. My bad, I overlooked the .015" as .0015." For the one that chambered, what measurement are you getting as per #21, and how far are you off the lands?

EE_Reloader said:

I sized another piece of brass and this one chambered correctly.

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I'm getting 1.804" per post #21. When you say lands you mean with loaded bullet? Cause I don't have loaded ammo, it's just the cases.

Perhaps, I am not smart enough but in 40 years of reloading, I have never measured shoulder bump.

As others have mentioned, I start with a case that won't chamber that is trimmed to the correct length and run the ram to the top of the stroke, turn the die down till it makes contact with case and then increase a 1/16th of a turn. Then test for chambering. I repeat that until it chambers. A 1/14 dies moves .00446.

I have never experienced excessive brass wear or other issues.

EE_Reloader said:

I'm getting 1.804" per post #21. When you say lands you mean with loaded bullet? Cause I don't have loaded ammo, it's just the cases.

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It might prevent you from chambering your brass if it is longer than spec. 1.804" might still be OK, regardless of that .015" bump you are measuring.

Yes, I was referring to loaded ammo. I asked because my load is with 215 Berger, and it is .080" of land.


Again, good luck with your troubleshooting.

I still think your brass is to hard and springing back. I know you said you annealed it on a a amp machine but how hot did you get it? And did you air cool the brass or was it thrown in cold water.
I use a bottle propane torch and get the shoulder a dull red in dark light on a hand drill with a pocket cleaner to hold the case in the flame and then immediately dump it into water. Brass doesn't act the same as steel.
Steel will harden when quenched,brass is the opposite.
I had the same problems as you until I started to annealing the brass until it was glowing red in very dark light.

@EE_Reloader
You are adjusting your die in-properly. Forget degrees of turn and cam over. Mark the lock ring with 12 equal points, then once touching the shell holder, turn the die IN 1/12 turn, size and measure headspace.
Continue if not enough, if too much, back it off 1/24th turn and check again.
I machined my body die to remove the shoulder portion, sorry I negated that fact in my earlier reply.
All WSM, RUM, Nosler cases have the same issue where the web is difficult to push back without increasing headspace excessively.

Hope this helps.

Cheers.

@Rotten when you first start using the AMP it has an analyze mode that essentially takes the case to a temperature where it is destroyed. From there the machine generates a code that is used to anneal all the cases. They recommend you chose a case that is representative of all cases in terms of weight, the median of your cases. I have used this for all my other cartridges I reload and it has been flawless. The cases are air cooled. I was under the impression with brass that air or water cooling doesn't really affect the final product.

@MagnumManiac I have another 50 brand new cases from this exact lot. I am going to do a size comparison on the web, headspace, etc. and see how much it has changed. I just need to find a bit more free time..

EE_Reloader said:

@Rotten when you first start using the AMP it has an analyze mode that essentially takes the case to a temperature where it is destroyed. From there the machine generates a code that is used to anneal all the cases. They recommend you chose a case that is representative of all cases in terms of weight, the median of your cases. I have used this for all my other cartridges I reload and it has been flawless. The cases are air cooled. I was under the impression with brass that air or water cooling doesn't really affect the final product.

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From watching amp videos it could take up to 3 pieces. I don't have an ample yet, but hopefully by next year to make custom sized for my needs. There should be a number preset for wsm.

Eric Cortina did video about annealing cases and the amount of pressure it took to seat the bullet and the effects on accuracy.
In the end it didn't seem to make a difference but it did effect the amount of force that it took to seat the bullet.
I don't really know if water quenching softens the brass or not as I've never actually tested, that is what I've always done.
Like casting lead bullets dropping them in water like steel will make them harder.
That I have tested .
So to say that quenching the brass in water vs air cooled I couldn't argue one way or the other. But I have had with two different full length dies not push the shoulder back far enough. I would have brass that had hard bolt closing until I started to annealing them the way I said in my last post
I could always be wrong but I would try it with 2 or 3 cases and see what you get.
This just comes from my experience.
Good luck with it I know it can be very frustrating chasing down problems.

Quenching brass does nothing to the brass structure, brass can ONLY be hardened by working, such as sizing and drawing over a mandrel.

Cheers.