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SOLD/EXPIRED WTS: RETUMBO 8 1lb cans

Shumba

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
Messages
167
Location
Fort Worth, TX
For Sale: 8 1lb xm unopened cans of RETUMBO all same lot #purchased last month at LGS. Asking what I paid for them $32.00 ea. I would like to sell as one transaction. Buyer pays shipping I will cover $25.00 Hazmat UPS charge. PayPal is preferred payment method.


 
The last time I shipped powder the UPS agent put a flammable sticker on the box in x number of places and charged $25.00 on top of normal shipping. It was pretty simple.
 
Propellant is a bit more than flammable......???

Thought you might wat to read this as it pertains to shippinng of propellants.......:

"
August 14, 2009


Mr. Craig M. Sanborn
President, MDM Ltd. & Black Mag Industries
RR 1 Box 405, 67 Private West 2
Maidstone, Vermont 05905
Ref. No. 09-0015
Dear Mr. Sanborn:
This responds to your January 9, 2009 letter regarding the applicability of the Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMR; 49 CFR Parts 100-185) to the packaging and transportation of smokeless powder for small arms. Your letter indicates that this material is manufactured by General Dynamics and approved as:
-- "Propellant, solid, 1.3C, UN0499" under approval number EX2003030244, and then reclassed as:
-- "Smokeless powder for small arms (100 pounds or less), 4.1, NA3178," under approval numbers EX2003030241 (Black Mag Solid Propellant in one pound plastic containers), and EX2003030241A (Black Mag w/Additive [P/N 90030-714] in one pound plastic containers), subject to the requirements and conditions set forth in the approvals and 49 CFR § 173.171.
Your questions are paraphrased and answered below.
Q1: May these products, when reclassed as "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I," be shipped under the small quantity exceptions provided in § 173.4 of the HMR?
A1: No. The small quantity exceptions in § 173.4 do not apply to explosive materials. When an explosive material (propellant, solid, 1.3C, UN0499) is reclassed as "Smokeless powder for small arms (100 pounds or less), 4.1, NA3178, PG I" under the terms of an approval, the requirements and conditions of the approval and § 173.171 control. Accordingly, when reclassed as a Division 4.1 material, this material may be transported by motor vehicle, rail car, vessel, or cargo-only aircraft, in accordance with the provisions provided therein. The approval only allows transport of a Division 1.3C explosive in specified small quantities as a Division 4.1 flammable solid. No other packaging, hazard communication, or classification exceptions are provided and the material is forbidden for transport on passenger aircraft.
Q2: May "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I" be shipped utilizing the exceptions provided Class 4 hazardous materials in § 173.151?

A2: No. As stated in A1 above, when examined and approved for classification as a Division 1.3C explosive and reclassed as "Smokeless powder for small arms (100 pounds or less), 4.1, NA3178, PG I," the packaging specified in the approval must be used to transport the smokeless powder. No other packaging, hazard communication, or classification exceptions are provided. The "None" in the entry "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I," in Column 8A of the HMT clearly indicates that the exceptions in § 173.151 for limited quantities and consumer commodities may not be utilized.
Q3: May "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I" be shipped as a Consumer Commodity eligible for the exceptions authorized Division 4.1 hazardous materials in
§ 173.151?
A3: No. See A2.
Q4: May "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I" be shipped as "Cartridges, small arms, ORM-D?"
A4: No. "Cartridges, small arms," as defined in § 173.59, means ammunition consisting of a cartridge case fitted with a center or rim fire primer and containing both a propelling charge and solid projectile(s). They are designed to be fired in weapons of caliber not larger than 19.1 mm. Shotgun cartridges of any caliber are included in this description. The term excludes "Cartridges, small arms, blank," and some military small arms cartridges listed under "Cartridges for weapons, inert projectile."
Q5: When transporting "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I," what packaging should be used?
A5: As authorized by approvals EX2003030241 and EX2003030241A, this classification is only valid when the smokeless powder for small arms (100 pounds or less) is shipped according to the requirements of § 173.171 and packaged as follows:
Inner Packaging – Bottles, heavy-wall static-resistant plastic with plastic screw cap, each containing not more than one pound of smokeless propellant for small arms.
Outer Packaging – Specification 4G fiberboard box, each containing not more than twenty-four (24) inner packagings in up to two layers of twelve with fiberboard dividers separating each inner packaging in a layer and fiberboard spacer between layers.
Further, the completed packages must be of the same type that had been examined as required in § 173.56.
Q6: May UPS set additional conditions or assess a hazmat fee for shipments of "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I?"
A6: Yes. As a common carrier, UPS may set its own conditions or requirements for transporting hazardous materials, so long as those conditions or requirements do not prevent compliance with the HMR, and it may assess a fee for the transportation of hazardous materials. These fees are neither mandated nor regulated by PHMSA.
I trust this satisfies your inquiry. Please contact us if we can be of further assistance.
Sincerely,
Edward T. Mazzullo
Director, Office of Hazardous
Materials Standards
173.171, 173.56, 173.59

From the United States Department of Transportation (DOT).
 
The last time I shipped powder the UPS agent put a flammable sticker on the box in x number of places and charged $25.00 on top of normal shipping. It was pretty simple.


...and the agent as well as you, the shipper and the consignee can be held responsibe both legally and criminally if something were to happen.

He's wrong.
 
Sidecarflip, thanks for the info, someone at UPS could have gotten myself and him in deep water. Powder has been sold FTF deal. Thank you for the interest and my apologies to those that I could not ship to.
 
When I got my CDL and Hazmat, they taught us that the special exception they are refering to is to reclassify the powder is to make it transportable as a flamable solid if less than 100 pounds WITH the Hazmat fee. Without this, gunpowder would be classified as an explosive and be out of the price range of most everyone.

When the box is stamped "flamable" that is for the shipping company only. The manifest of the package must show it's original classification and the truck or container must be placarded as "flamable solid." If under 100 pounds.

This package must remain as ground only.

Propellant is a bit more than flammable......???

Thought you might wat to read this as it pertains to shippinng of propellants.......:

"
August 14, 2009


Mr. Craig M. Sanborn
President, MDM Ltd. & Black Mag Industries
RR 1 Box 405, 67 Private West 2
Maidstone, Vermont 05905
Ref. No. 09-0015
Dear Mr. Sanborn:
This responds to your January 9, 2009 letter regarding the applicability of the Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMR; 49 CFR Parts 100-185) to the packaging and transportation of smokeless powder for small arms. Your letter indicates that this material is manufactured by General Dynamics and approved as:
-- "Propellant, solid, 1.3C, UN0499" under approval number EX2003030244, and then reclassed as:
-- "Smokeless powder for small arms (100 pounds or less), 4.1, NA3178," under approval numbers EX2003030241 (Black Mag Solid Propellant in one pound plastic containers), and EX2003030241A (Black Mag w/Additive [P/N 90030-714] in one pound plastic containers), subject to the requirements and conditions set forth in the approvals and 49 CFR § 173.171.
Your questions are paraphrased and answered below.
Q1: May these products, when reclassed as "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I," be shipped under the small quantity exceptions provided in § 173.4 of the HMR?
A1: No. The small quantity exceptions in § 173.4 do not apply to explosive materials. When an explosive material (propellant, solid, 1.3C, UN0499) is reclassed as "Smokeless powder for small arms (100 pounds or less), 4.1, NA3178, PG I" under the terms of an approval, the requirements and conditions of the approval and § 173.171 control. Accordingly, when reclassed as a Division 4.1 material, this material may be transported by motor vehicle, rail car, vessel, or cargo-only aircraft, in accordance with the provisions provided therein. The approval only allows transport of a Division 1.3C explosive in specified small quantities as a Division 4.1 flammable solid. No other packaging, hazard communication, or classification exceptions are provided and the material is forbidden for transport on passenger aircraft.
Q2: May "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I" be shipped utilizing the exceptions provided Class 4 hazardous materials in § 173.151?

A2: No. As stated in A1 above, when examined and approved for classification as a Division 1.3C explosive and reclassed as "Smokeless powder for small arms (100 pounds or less), 4.1, NA3178, PG I," the packaging specified in the approval must be used to transport the smokeless powder. No other packaging, hazard communication, or classification exceptions are provided. The "None" in the entry "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I," in Column 8A of the HMT clearly indicates that the exceptions in § 173.151 for limited quantities and consumer commodities may not be utilized.
Q3: May "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I" be shipped as a Consumer Commodity eligible for the exceptions authorized Division 4.1 hazardous materials in
§ 173.151?
A3: No. See A2.
Q4: May "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I" be shipped as "Cartridges, small arms, ORM-D?"
A4: No. "Cartridges, small arms," as defined in § 173.59, means ammunition consisting of a cartridge case fitted with a center or rim fire primer and containing both a propelling charge and solid projectile(s). They are designed to be fired in weapons of caliber not larger than 19.1 mm. Shotgun cartridges of any caliber are included in this description. The term excludes "Cartridges, small arms, blank," and some military small arms cartridges listed under "Cartridges for weapons, inert projectile."
Q5: When transporting "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I," what packaging should be used?
A5: As authorized by approvals EX2003030241 and EX2003030241A, this classification is only valid when the smokeless powder for small arms (100 pounds or less) is shipped according to the requirements of § 173.171 and packaged as follows:
Inner Packaging – Bottles, heavy-wall static-resistant plastic with plastic screw cap, each containing not more than one pound of smokeless propellant for small arms.
Outer Packaging – Specification 4G fiberboard box, each containing not more than twenty-four (24) inner packagings in up to two layers of twelve with fiberboard dividers separating each inner packaging in a layer and fiberboard spacer between layers.
Further, the completed packages must be of the same type that had been examined as required in § 173.56.
Q6: May UPS set additional conditions or assess a hazmat fee for shipments of "Smokeless powder for small arms, 4.1, NA3178, I?"
A6: Yes. As a common carrier, UPS may set its own conditions or requirements for transporting hazardous materials, so long as those conditions or requirements do not prevent compliance with the HMR, and it may assess a fee for the transportation of hazardous materials. These fees are neither mandated nor regulated by PHMSA.
I trust this satisfies your inquiry. Please contact us if we can be of further assistance.
Sincerely,
Edward T. Mazzullo
Director, Office of Hazardous
Materials Standards
173.171, 173.56, 173.59

From the United States Department of Transportation (DOT).
 
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