Trouble sizing 7mm Weatherby brass

[winelines]

I had a custom 7mm bee put together for me a number of years ago. The guys on this forum helped a lot in selecting components, etc. I initially bought 7 boxes of new unprimed weatherby brass and one box of weatherby factory ammo for a baseline. When I shot the fact ammo for the first time, I was surprised that it took a little pressure on the bolt handle to close it. Usually fact ammo is minimum size. After the first loading of the new brass, I used a full length Forster die and a Redding comp shell holder set with the intent of bumping the shoulder .002. I found that using the .006 shell holder allowed me to chamber a round pretty easily. Worked up a load with a 180 Berger bullet and H1000 powder and was off to the races. The gun was a shooter! Fast forward 11 years. I go to reload the shells for the 3rd time and in checking the first piece of sized brass in the gun, find that it takes a lot of pressure to close the bolt. So, I try the .oo8 shell holder and find that I am getting warping around the shoulder and they won't chamber. I'm not sure what's going on here, and more importantly, what I should do next. I obviously have a chamber near minimum spec size. I can't buy new brass right now and its ridiculously expensive. Will a custom die solve the issue, or do I need to have the chamber rebored with a different reamer? Any help would be greatly appreciated

 

[slikmrc]

First thing I would do is clean and inspect the die for corrosion. Cases may need to be annealed, I'd also check the case odd above the belt before and after sizing to see if they are growing during sizing. Hope this helps.

 

[cape cove]

What may be happening is the area just in front of the belt may be enlarging to the point where it is hard to close the bolt . This happens with belted mags from time to time when there is a resizing die that does not match up good with your chamber. You may need one of these dies Innovative Technologies - Reloading Equipment (larrywillis.com). This die will size that place just north of the belt allowing good chambering. Would you have by chance have another sizing die for a belted mag such as the 300 Weath or 300 Win mag.

 

[MagnumManiac]

I have several Weatherby chambers, mine are all on Winchester actions.
I find the radius shoulder difficult to size over traditional angled shoulders.
It appears they resist the sizing and have more spring back.
Example, my 375 Bee requires a shell holder with .010" machined off it's top to be able to push the shoulder back enough to even get a case to chamber at 0 headspace. Another manipulation is required in a separate step to get ANY headspace at all.
My 270 Bee is not quite as bad, but also requires extra sizing to chamber.
My 300 and 340 Bee are also hard to size, at first I thought I needed more case lube, this just resulted in wrinkled cases and no extra sizing.
Measuring taught me a lot, these cases resist sizing and spring back more.

Cheers.

 

[winelines]

Thanks for your reply. I did those two, in addition to cleaning and scoping the chamber. Dimensionally, it appears to be a shoulder problem.

 

[winelines]

Thanks MM. I have both an of the rack .257 and 300 Wbee and have not had any issues. But you are definitely on the right track. I'm just not sure where to go from here.

What may be happening is the area just in front of the belt may be enlarging to the point where it is hard to close the bolt . This happens with belted mags from time to time when there is a resizing die that does not match up good with your chamber. You may need one of these dies Innovative Technologies - Reloading Equipment (larrywillis.com). This die will size that place just north of the belt allowing good chambering. Would you have by chance have another sizing die for a belted mag such as the 300 Weath or 300 Win mag.

Thanks for you suggestion CC. Just above the belt is fine, its the area around shoulder transition that is the issue.

 

[Dr. Vette]

Can you bump the shoulder down a bit more?

One trick I use in a case like this -
Use a black Sharpie and completely darken a couple of cases from mid case to the mouth.
Run a case in the rifle, paying attention to position as it enters so you know what part was facing "up."
Remove case, and see where it is getting interference. It will usually remove the black Sharpie mark where there is an issue.

If you don't see anything, darken a case from mid body to the belt, and do the same thing.

One of these will tell you where you're getting interference.

Oh, do you have the Hornady headspace gauge, and do you use it to measure the shoulder location?

 

[kiwikid]

Now I may have this wrong but I believe you should try the .004" shell holder not the .008". It is my belief that the. 008" shell holder resizes the case less than the .006" shell holder.

 

[winelines]

Now I may have this wrong but I believe you should try the .004" shell holder not the .008". It is my belief that the. 008" shell holder resizes the case less than the .006" shell holder.

No, kiwikid. The higher # sizes the case more. When I bought them many years ago I measured the thickness of each and the higher # is thinner thus driving the case further into the die.

Can you bump the shoulder down a bit more?

One trick I use in a case like this -
Use a black Sharpie and completely darken a couple of cases from mid case to the mouth.
Run a case in the rifle, paying attention to position as it enters so you know what part was facing "up."
Remove case, and see where it is getting interference. It will usually remove the black Sharpie mark where there is an issue.

If you don't see anything, darken a case from mid body to the belt, and do the same thing.

One of these will tell you where you're getting interference.

Oh, do you have the Hornady headspace gauge, and do you use it to measure the shoulder location?

Dr. Vette - I did try the .008 shell holder and started to get warping on the shoulder.
I don't have the Hornady gage, but I think it pretty clear (I did ink the brass) that too much metal in the shoulder area is the culprit. With today's condition on brass and ammo availability, my major issue is trying to find a way to save the brass having only been reloaded 3 times with very minimal shoulder pushback.

 

[winelines]

What may be happening is the area just in front of the belt may be enlarging to the point where it is hard to close the bolt . This happens with belted mags from time to time when there is a resizing die that does not match up good with your chamber. You may need one of these dies Innovative Technologies - Reloading Equipment (larrywillis.com). This die will size that place just north of the belt allowing good chambering. Would you have by chance have another sizing die for a belted mag such as the 300 Weath or 300 Win mag.

cape cove,

I do have a factory .300 Weatherby Euromark and load for it. Were you thinking of some way to use that die?

 

[Dr. Vette]

I've resized 7mm Wby brass thousands of times (hundreds of cases here) and in general I've fixed problems like this one of a few ways.

Trimming the brass - it grew and I forgot to check.
Resizing to the belt - Willis collet die to the rescue.
Bumping the shoulder a bit more - I can tell you that the shoulder will get a bit longer just before you size it shorter. I measured it with the 300 Wby this week. I suspect this may be happening. I mean, what's the worst thing you do - size a case a bit too short, or ruin 2 cases in the attempt?

If you can't figure it out, feel free to send me a few and we'll get it figured out.

 

[rsnell]

The Willis collet die is the solution to your problem. I am not aware of any full length sizing die that will resize the area directly above the belt. Although expensive, approximately $120, it will work for a number of belted cases. The problem can be eliminated to some extent by using a full length sizing die to set the shoulder back approximately 0.002 inches before the chambering problem appears.

 

[eschafer]

I too believe kiwikid is correct on the use of the Redding Competition Shell Holders.. The larger number on the shell holders does drop the case lower, leaving the die higher thus sizing the case less.... Measuring "deck height" will confirm this for you, not measuring "floor-plate"..

https://www. youtube.com/watch?v=pgA3ALkheHM

 

[winelines]

OK. Guys. Just ordered a Willis die. Thank you all for your suggestions. Will let you know how it works out