Single shot edge or Lapua????

[oldfamily]

Picked up a remington 700 for the action, planning on building a single shot rifle with it. Was thinking between the edge and the 338 lapua. What would work best when rifle would be set up for single shot use. Want to use 30 inch barrel, muzzle break, one of Joel's stocks, with a 1.25 straight contour barrel if I can. Don't care how many pounds it is. Will be shot at targets and for sit and watching of fields. Just don't know if the edge would have any thing over the Lapua when I only want a single shot. Thanks Oldfamily.

 

[James Jones]

Is the action CM or SS ,if its SS then certainly the Edge. the 338 Lapua is right at the brink for being to fat and to much pressure for the CM action in my oppinion ,it can be done and it can be done safely on the SS ation also but you had better keep the pressure at or under SAMMI specs.

The 338 Lapua will out run the Edge especialy in the improved version mostly because of the strength of the brass.. When loaded to "accurate" speeds then they are likely very close to each other then it boils down to cost of brass ,the Lapua is WAY higher but you can shoot factroy ammo and it will last a long time ..

If it were me then I'd build the 338 Lapua improved with a 30-32" barrel and use the slowest powder I could find with the 300 gr SMK's , use all the barrel to burn that powder.


As for the actual build , I would use a 9" bedding block and free float the action and other side of the barrel , the barrel will have the harmonics close to that of a 21" barrel due to the bedding block wipeing most of that out this will help in accuracy alot. But if you don't want the block the I'd have the action converted to a 40x by welding in a single shot follower , this will stiffen the action alot , then use a barrel of #7 at most and bed the first few inches of that so as not to stress the action to much.

 

[davewilson]

if i understand your statement about the type of steel and what to build on correctly, i would have to disagree with you. basically a CM action is stronger than SS.

 

[Fiftydriver]

I have found the SS receivers to be more likely to have bolt lug set back much more then the harder Chrome Moly steel. Just my experience.

Comparing the two rounds, there really is not any difference between them. The Edge will fit into the Rem 700 much easier so that is what I would recommend on that receiver.

 

[P KUNDA]

CM is stronger then SS

Is the action CM or SS ,if its SS then certainly the Edge. the 338 Lapua is right at the brink for being to fat and to much pressure for the CM action in my oppinion ,it can be done and it can be done safely on the SS ation also but you had better keep the pressure at or under SAMMI specs.

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The Lapua rim is too big for the original 700 extractor. A M16 or a Sako type extractor has to be fitted and the bolt head strength/gas system compromised.

Peter

 

[jwp475]

Nothing wrong with a SS M-700 in 338 Laupa IMHO

Here's mine;

 

[James Jones]

What I was saying was that the 338 Lapua can be built on both CM and SS actions safely if you don't get into the higher than factroy pressure range and if your going to push anwhere above that range the actions should be a CM. Yes CM is stronger than SS in most rife actions the SS actions will get lug battering and setback like Kirby mentioned before a CM action will and thats with any case that has alot of taper to it as the taper increases bolt thrust.

If you have a SS action and your set on the 338 Lapua case then Ackley improving it would be a good idea , this will greatly reduce bolt thrust , it makes the case more effecient so you will gain some speed with little increase in chamber pressure if you use a little slower powder utilizing the increased case capacity.

In either action the CM and the SS I personaly feel that the 338 Lapua is on the brink of this actions abilities and more so with the Stainless.

Sorry that I had written that so confusing the first time ,it sounded correct when I was thinking it.

 

[jwp475]

Remongton is producing the M-700 chmbered in 338 Lapua. They are only listed in their Law Enforcement Division. Remington has tested them to 100K is with no damage to the action my understanding if this is not correct please fell free to correct.

 

[oldfamily]

action is blued cm

 

[James Jones]

100,000 psi iwth any case in a Rem 700 action is a very bad idea , not saying that it won't handel it but it surely won't do it to many times more then the first.

If the actions is built up correctly meening that its blue printed and everything is strait then maybe the CM action would hold 100,000 psi for more than one shot but my guess is that it would gall the lugs to the action and it would be ruined.

Shooting factroy ammo which isin't supposed to exceed 65,000 psi either the CM or the SS action will work , the SS being softer will likely start to suffer from the increased bolt thrust before the CM will.

But back to the task at hand , on a CM action then you should be perfectly safe with the 338 Lapua if you don't get stupid with the pressures. Thats like anything else you try to get a 338 winchester to run with the 338 Lapua then your gonna have trouble.

What is it that your gonna be asking this gun to do , as far as ranges and critters

 

[jwp475]

Not advocating shooting that much pressure, just saying that is how high that I understand they have proof tested. I believe that SAAMI pressure is high enough, and I do not advocate exceeding SAAMI.

 

[oldfamily]

What is it that your gonna be asking this gun to do , as far as ranges and critters

Rifle will be paper puncher,rock blaster, whitetail deer critter smacker. Don't plan on it being anywhere near a carry gun, and don't want it to be. If for some reason it would go over 20 pounds I would not care. This is why I want a single shot, no need to have a shell to back up the first if you have the rifle put together right and you do your part on making the shot.

 

[Fiftydriver]

THe whole kicker in this game is the Lapua case. Most conventional handloaders load up to where the primer pockets begin to loosen and then back off a certain amount and consider that their max load for the rifle. With nearly all conventional brass casings, this is perfectly acceptable because they will begin to show primer pocket loosening right around 65,000 psi which is a good safe max pressure for a modern bolt action rifle chambered in any magnum chambering.

The problem is that the Lapua case will take 65,000 psi and not even break a sweat!!! In fact I have seen tests results where the Lapua was loaded up to well over 70,000 psi and primer pockets still held tight for several firings per case.

If a handloader is using primer pocket tightness to read pressures and loads the Lapua up until the primer pockets loosen, they will be stepping well past 70K psi and in my opinion, while the Rem 700 may handle this, over the long haul, it would be very hard on this receiver, any factory receiver for that matter, Sako, Wby, any of them.

If you get a Rem 700 converted to use the Lapua case or a wildcat Based on the Lapua case and load it properly, the Rem 700 will work perfectly well assuming its built correctly. If you push the Lapua to its case pressure limits, you will be getting into dangerous areas!!!!

One reason I have gone to mostly custom receivers for the Lapua class chamberings is because I had a customer come into the shop one day with a rifle I had made him chambered in 338 Lapua. He could not be happerier with the rifle, shooting well under 1/2 moa at 500 yards which was the farthest he had tested yet. When I asked him what load he was using he said he was getting the 250 gr SMK up to 3150 fps!!!! With long case life and no increase in bolt lift.

I instantly set the guy down and told him he was pushing his rifle WAY harder then he should be and that he needed do drop her down into the 2900 fps range for his barrel length. With his hot loads you could open the bolt with one finger and yes cases were lasting a long time but that does not mean pressures were far over what the Rem 700 should be loaded to.

Another aquaintance of mine told me he was loosening the primer pockets on his 338 Lapua, Sako TRG-S I beleive it was. I asked him if he realized how much pressure it takes to do that to Lapua cases. He almost turned white when I told him.

Again, if the Lapua is loaded properly, no problem but its potential to handle much higher pressures and not show pressure signs on the case is what concerns me for the most part.

I would rather chamber the Rem 700 for the 338-378 Wby or 338 Kahn simply because the primer pockets will let loose with anything much over 65,000 psi which is a built in safety limiter IF the handloader is paying attention.

Just my opinion,

 

[James Jones]

speeking of actions and big cases , Kirby how is your Raptor project comming along?

Not to highjack "oldfamily's" post , But In this case the best bet may be to sell the Rem 700 action and invest in a little bigger stronger action that way you can get all the good out of the big case.