I have a rem 700 lss in 30-06 and would like to get somthing with more range. I like the gun but not the ballistics. I dont know alot about putting a different barrel on the gun. My first choice would be a 7mm rem mag, but dont know if it would work. or should I just sell the gun and buy a diff one. Any suggestions would be appreciated. would like to have a gun cappable of deer out to around 600 yrd. (for hunting powerlines)
rem 700 rebarrel options.
- Thread starter 182a
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I'm not a gunsmith, but I do know that your 30-06 can be rebarrelled to any long action or magnum you want. I think the ultra mags would also work, but I'm not 100% sure. Your bolt will need to be opened up for a magnum. You have a good action and a nice stock, I would just rebarrel. Let's see what others have to say.
royinidaho
Well-Known Member
Your rifle is a good one to build on if you wish, so I wouldn't consider dumping it for a different cal.
Additionally there is no reason a good shooting '06 with say 150s or 165 or so weights wouldn't be a good 600 yard deer rifle.
Another cartridge, say the 6.5-06 might be flatter shooting but if the deer can't be hit with the 30 it can't be hit w/the 6.5 either.
I'd strongly consider working up the load, working up the drop chart @ 100 yd steps out to 600 yds, then decide if she doesn't cut the mustard.
Just a tho't
Additionally there is no reason a good shooting '06 with say 150s or 165 or so weights wouldn't be a good 600 yard deer rifle.
Another cartridge, say the 6.5-06 might be flatter shooting but if the deer can't be hit with the 30 it can't be hit w/the 6.5 either.
I'd strongly consider working up the load, working up the drop chart @ 100 yd steps out to 600 yds, then decide if she doesn't cut the mustard.
Just a tho't
ol mike
Well-Known Member
As Roy stated out to 600yds a 30-06 will do fine w/the right bullet.
I am in the same boat as you i'm thought about going from an 06 to a 7mm STW.It takes some work=money to do and after doing some research i've decided on the 280 AI =ackley improved.
I guess you know there are many cartridges based on the 30-06 case -a 280 rem is a 30-06 necked down to 28 caliber as is a 270 and 25-06.
The AI=ackley improved version is a 40* shoulder put on the cartridge it cuts way back on brass trimming and adds powder volume to the case.Ballpark 150 ish fps.
The 280/7mm class calibers have many great bullets to choose from.
A 26-27" long barrel- 280 AI w/a 1-9 twist will shoot the heavy high bc bullets just fine.This cartridge is right on the heels of a 7mm magnum -w/ less powder.
Bullets like the 162 a-max ,168 berger and 175 smk's will wack a deer at 600yds w/authority.
Nosler now makes brass ready to load <- sized -chamfered ready to go!
As far as rebarreling goes -once you have a top notch barrel installed you'll understand why people do it-accurate ,easy to clean and consistant.
There are a few gunsmiths that frequent this site -fiftydriver is one -Kirby Allen is his name he helps out on here alot.
I don't think you'll find a much better cartridge that tha 280 AI ,there are many to choose from but as i said earlier it will take a little more work/money.
Best of luck -Mike
I am in the same boat as you i'm thought about going from an 06 to a 7mm STW.It takes some work=money to do and after doing some research i've decided on the 280 AI =ackley improved.
I guess you know there are many cartridges based on the 30-06 case -a 280 rem is a 30-06 necked down to 28 caliber as is a 270 and 25-06.
The AI=ackley improved version is a 40* shoulder put on the cartridge it cuts way back on brass trimming and adds powder volume to the case.Ballpark 150 ish fps.
The 280/7mm class calibers have many great bullets to choose from.
A 26-27" long barrel- 280 AI w/a 1-9 twist will shoot the heavy high bc bullets just fine.This cartridge is right on the heels of a 7mm magnum -w/ less powder.
Bullets like the 162 a-max ,168 berger and 175 smk's will wack a deer at 600yds w/authority.
Nosler now makes brass ready to load <- sized -chamfered ready to go!
As far as rebarreling goes -once you have a top notch barrel installed you'll understand why people do it-accurate ,easy to clean and consistant.
There are a few gunsmiths that frequent this site -fiftydriver is one -Kirby Allen is his name he helps out on here alot.
I don't think you'll find a much better cartridge that tha 280 AI ,there are many to choose from but as i said earlier it will take a little more work/money.
Best of luck -Mike
James Jones
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2002
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- 2,854
the 30-06 with a 24-26" barrel is enought gun to push a 180gr class bullet out to 600yds easly. A few questions first.
Does the gun shoot accuratly now?
Are you wanting magnum recoil and blast?
What kind of critters are you planning to hunt at 600yds?
Do you reload ?
My longest kill on a deer is 618yds and that was with a 308 and a factory loaded 175gr Sierra Match King bullet.
Check your gun out , have it bedded , the trigger worked and the crown recut generaly these three things will cut your groups a good bit and turn an ok shoot gun into a respectible rig. If it'll shoot 1 moa consistanly then it'll make a fine 600yd deer gun.
Get yourself some 178gr A-max bullets and a pound of 4350 powder and start working up loads. that bullet with that powder should get you at least 2700 fps more than likely 2800 fps and that bullet will shoot pretty flat.
Does the gun shoot accuratly now?
Are you wanting magnum recoil and blast?
What kind of critters are you planning to hunt at 600yds?
Do you reload ?
My longest kill on a deer is 618yds and that was with a 308 and a factory loaded 175gr Sierra Match King bullet.
Check your gun out , have it bedded , the trigger worked and the crown recut generaly these three things will cut your groups a good bit and turn an ok shoot gun into a respectible rig. If it'll shoot 1 moa consistanly then it'll make a fine 600yd deer gun.
Get yourself some 178gr A-max bullets and a pound of 4350 powder and start working up loads. that bullet with that powder should get you at least 2700 fps more than likely 2800 fps and that bullet will shoot pretty flat.
davewilson
Well-Known Member
i agree with JD and the others that say you've got plenty of gun.if you can't get a deer at 600 with a 3006, a magnum won't help.178 a-max,whatever powder that works,i've always had the best results with 414 powder in 3 different 06's i've shot. get this gun to shoot well,practice and read on here for a year, and then build a long range cannon if you gotta have one.
Hi the 3006 will shoot a 190gr Match projectile past 1000 yards in your factory rifle. But it will not be as flat as other cartriges. the first Question is what do you want to do with it? The rifle you has can be rechambered to 300 Win Mag or 300 Ultra mag and the boltface would need modifying. If the rifle is not to accurate and you do not want a 30 cal you can have it rebarreled to any case you want including Kirby's Allen Mags and Shawn's 338 Edge. Decide the distance you want to shoot and the calibre you are partial to and you could make an awsome LR rifle out of your existing 3006. I prefer making a magnum out of a 3006 bolt if a Sako extractor is being fitted as it means you do not have to fill in the Rem extractor groove before fitting the extractor you just remove the existion 3006 grove and open it to the magnum boltface.
Cheers Bill
Australia
Cheers Bill
Australia
Lots of good info. Ive been trying several 180 grain factory loads b/c that is what i was told would be the most accurate size for the 06. I'v had 2.5" groups at 100 yds since the gun was new. (nikon monarch scope) so to answer you question the gun isnt impressive with regaurds to accuracy. I'm fine with magnum recoil/ blast. Mostly deer hunting on powerlines. I dont reload, but it sounds like from you and others that thats the way to get consistent accurate loads. Also tha barrel is only 22". how much will that limit the range of the gun. Basically im tired of having to pass on deer past 400 yrds b/c i havent been able to get enough accuracy from the gun to be sure of a clean kill.
Hi as the barrel is only 22" and is not a real tack holer i would look at at least rebarreling with a diferent cartrige. If you want the easiest modification a 280 Ackley Improved would be my first option but if you are wiling to put a bit more into it a 26" slim profile barrel in a magnum of some sort the 7mm Rem Ultra MAg would be a good option or the 300 Ultra or 338 Edge will all give you better performance. If the deer are on the smaler size a 270 Allen MAg or 270-7mm Ultra mag with long 165 or 195gr Wildcat projectiles would be awsome or just the 7mm Ultra with a 9 twist and 200gr Wildcat projectiles you will have an awsome long range powerline rifle. Have the action squared larger recoil lug fitted adjust the trigger pillar bed the action fit a good Muzzle Break and go for it. Shawn also has an adjustable cheek piece that can be fitted to make an awsome rifle. Also tha bolt will have to have a Sako type extractor fitted and opened to magnum size i would fit a Wyats extended mag box aswell. If you want great barrel life go the 338 Edge if you want all out performance go either of the 270's or 7mm Ultra MAg.
Cheers Bill
Australia
Cheers Bill
Australia
James Jones
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2002
- Messages
- 2,854
Another question is How much money are you willing to spend? And exactly what kind of accuracy are you looking for.
If deer are your main target and 600yds is your basic max range I woulden't bother with a Mag case , Any of the rounds on the 06 case with good bullets will get youa 600yd deer gun.
If you reload my first choice would be the 6.5-06 , then the 280Ai. both of these guns will get you on targets to 1000yds easly and will kill deer to 600 yds , and if you ever get the itch to hunt elk they will kill elk to 400yds and maybe more if you choose your shots
If deer are your main target and 600yds is your basic max range I woulden't bother with a Mag case , Any of the rounds on the 06 case with good bullets will get youa 600yd deer gun.
If you reload my first choice would be the 6.5-06 , then the 280Ai. both of these guns will get you on targets to 1000yds easly and will kill deer to 600 yds , and if you ever get the itch to hunt elk they will kill elk to 400yds and maybe more if you choose your shots
ol mike
Well-Known Member
182a ,
TAKE UP HANDLOADING !!
I thought i knew about guns for years and in retrospect i knew very little.
Do you use 'real'copper removing barrel cleaner? If not your barrel could be heavily fouled and causing bad performance -2.5" groups-.
Get some wipe-out and the accelerator that goes w/it.There are many good ones -shooters choice-,montana xtreme,coppermelt etc-etc..Your barrel has to be cleaned --clean.
I use to think oil was all they needed /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif.
Go buy a basic rcbs handloading kit and load developement manual + 30-06 dies [get 3 die kit-full length-neck sizing-bullet seating] and just start looking it over piece by piece and you'll see just how simple it is !
I enjoy every minute of loading.My 25-06 which is a little pickier than a 30-06 to load for took me very little time to have it shooting 3/4" five shot groups.
Factory ammo is too expensive for me handloading hasn't saved me any money -i just shoot alot more.
If you have any questions about the loading process just ask -you'll get quick accurate answers on here.
Send that few hundred bucks and you'll be glad you did !
When you get a good load worked up go out and do some shooting at longrange and see what your bullet drops are and write them down and tape it to the side of your rifle.
You 'have to have' a rangefinder or change to a mildot type scope.
Get a rangefinder of at least 800 yds the more powerful they are the easier they range shorter distances.
When sending a bullet at a game animal at longrange it's not a guessing game!
Best of luck and let us know your progress--Mike
TAKE UP HANDLOADING !!
I thought i knew about guns for years and in retrospect i knew very little.
Do you use 'real'copper removing barrel cleaner? If not your barrel could be heavily fouled and causing bad performance -2.5" groups-.
Get some wipe-out and the accelerator that goes w/it.There are many good ones -shooters choice-,montana xtreme,coppermelt etc-etc..Your barrel has to be cleaned --clean.
I use to think oil was all they needed /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif.
Go buy a basic rcbs handloading kit and load developement manual + 30-06 dies [get 3 die kit-full length-neck sizing-bullet seating] and just start looking it over piece by piece and you'll see just how simple it is !
I enjoy every minute of loading.My 25-06 which is a little pickier than a 30-06 to load for took me very little time to have it shooting 3/4" five shot groups.
Factory ammo is too expensive for me handloading hasn't saved me any money -i just shoot alot more.
If you have any questions about the loading process just ask -you'll get quick accurate answers on here.
Send that few hundred bucks and you'll be glad you did !
When you get a good load worked up go out and do some shooting at longrange and see what your bullet drops are and write them down and tape it to the side of your rifle.
You 'have to have' a rangefinder or change to a mildot type scope.
Get a rangefinder of at least 800 yds the more powerful they are the easier they range shorter distances.
When sending a bullet at a game animal at longrange it's not a guessing game!
Best of luck and let us know your progress--Mike
Fiftydriver
Official LRH Sponsor
First off, you have a platform there that you could build pretty much anything you can imagine on up to and including all the RUMs and the wildcats based off them. Only rounds I would stay away from with that Stainless Steel receiver would be the very large ones based on the Lapua and big Wby cases. If it were a chrome moly receiver I would feel comfortable with those as well but not on the softer Stainless receivers. More then likely you would have no problems but that is not good enough to recommend it.
600 yards is pretty easy to reach consistantly with todays modern chamberings and bullets. The simplest way to get this would be to leave the receiver set up for the '06 size case head rounds and wildcats. Three come to mind right away and most have already been mentioned, 25-06 AI, 6.5-06 AI and the 280 Rem AI.
I like the AI rounds based on the '06. They will in most cases get you so close in performance to the standard length belted magnums in the same caliber its almost embarrassing, especially in barrels in the 24" lengths. Longer barrels will get you more with the magnums but the shorter ones will not be so impressive.
Also, with the correct bullet selection, all three of these will get you easy 600 yard reach on deer size game. The 25-06 AI is probably the most challanging to get to this range effectively as the list of factory bullet options is somewhat limited but if you were to use the Wildcat 125 to 142 gr ULD RBBT you would easily have this much reach. The 110 gr Accubond and 115 gr Ballistic Tip will work but will be blown around a bit more in the wind and retained velocity and energy will be less then the more efficent Wildcat ULD RBBTs.
The 6.5-06 AI is pretty much my idea of the all around star for deer in an '06 sized case. Bullets are easy to get for long range shooting, I have a boat load if the new 130 gr Accubonds headed my way to test in this very round and the 6.5mm WSM as well as my much larger 6.5 Allen Xpress and 6.5mm Allen Magnum.
Any of the tipped bullets in 129 to 140 gr range will be impressive performers on deer out to 600 yards easily, even farther in fact. Plus you also have the choice of alot of very quality long range match bullets such as the ones from Wildcat, Berger and Sierra. Personally, I feel the 6.5mm is a little small to be using their match bullets on big game, I perfer 7mm or larger for match bullets but I can not deny they work extremely well, just not alot of frontal area for shots on the fringes when they occur. That said, you put one through the vitals, deer is dead.
The 280 Rem AI is a great round as well, in a 24" barrel will come very close to many 7mm Rem Mag loads and will top most factory 7mm Rem Mag loads. FOr 600 yards, the 140 gr bullets will work, 150 are better and in my opinion, the 160 to 170 gr class are the best. In that class you have the 160 gr Accubond, 162 gr A-Max and the 169.5 gr ULD RBBT.
I personally feel anything heavier then these are a bit more then the 280 AI will handle properly in a hunting rifles.
Thats the easiest way to go. If you want more performance however, there is alot more to be had. If you have read any of my posts you realize I really do not know what the term overkill means!!
To me 600 yard deer hunting is still long range, in certain situations 300 yard shots on deer can be considered long range and in those cases, power is really the only thing I would be concerned about. There are many wildcats and factory chamberings that will get you to that range with alot of power. As mentioned, the 7mm RUM and 300 RUM are great choices but also are the 7mm Rem Mag, 7mm STW, 7mm Dakota, 300 Win Mag, 300 Wby.
Wildcats, obviously my personal favorites would be my own children. For deer hunting, take your pick, 257 AX, 6.5 AX, 270 AX, 257 AM, 6.5mm AM or 270 AM. All will make 600 yard reach pretty much silly ballistically. Easiest to load for would be the 270 AM and also the highest performing when looking at trajectory and retained energy as well.
You do not need a wildcat however. A 7mm STW or 7mm RUM is what some would call over kill at 600 yards but loaded with the right bullets, when the wind is blowing across a big canyon, the extra Horse power can make the shot if your practiced with the rifle whereas the smaller rounds will often fall short enough to prevent a practical shot to be attemped.
So really, the sky is the limit.
Kirby Allen(50)
600 yards is pretty easy to reach consistantly with todays modern chamberings and bullets. The simplest way to get this would be to leave the receiver set up for the '06 size case head rounds and wildcats. Three come to mind right away and most have already been mentioned, 25-06 AI, 6.5-06 AI and the 280 Rem AI.
I like the AI rounds based on the '06. They will in most cases get you so close in performance to the standard length belted magnums in the same caliber its almost embarrassing, especially in barrels in the 24" lengths. Longer barrels will get you more with the magnums but the shorter ones will not be so impressive.
Also, with the correct bullet selection, all three of these will get you easy 600 yard reach on deer size game. The 25-06 AI is probably the most challanging to get to this range effectively as the list of factory bullet options is somewhat limited but if you were to use the Wildcat 125 to 142 gr ULD RBBT you would easily have this much reach. The 110 gr Accubond and 115 gr Ballistic Tip will work but will be blown around a bit more in the wind and retained velocity and energy will be less then the more efficent Wildcat ULD RBBTs.
The 6.5-06 AI is pretty much my idea of the all around star for deer in an '06 sized case. Bullets are easy to get for long range shooting, I have a boat load if the new 130 gr Accubonds headed my way to test in this very round and the 6.5mm WSM as well as my much larger 6.5 Allen Xpress and 6.5mm Allen Magnum.
Any of the tipped bullets in 129 to 140 gr range will be impressive performers on deer out to 600 yards easily, even farther in fact. Plus you also have the choice of alot of very quality long range match bullets such as the ones from Wildcat, Berger and Sierra. Personally, I feel the 6.5mm is a little small to be using their match bullets on big game, I perfer 7mm or larger for match bullets but I can not deny they work extremely well, just not alot of frontal area for shots on the fringes when they occur. That said, you put one through the vitals, deer is dead.
The 280 Rem AI is a great round as well, in a 24" barrel will come very close to many 7mm Rem Mag loads and will top most factory 7mm Rem Mag loads. FOr 600 yards, the 140 gr bullets will work, 150 are better and in my opinion, the 160 to 170 gr class are the best. In that class you have the 160 gr Accubond, 162 gr A-Max and the 169.5 gr ULD RBBT.
I personally feel anything heavier then these are a bit more then the 280 AI will handle properly in a hunting rifles.
Thats the easiest way to go. If you want more performance however, there is alot more to be had. If you have read any of my posts you realize I really do not know what the term overkill means!!
To me 600 yard deer hunting is still long range, in certain situations 300 yard shots on deer can be considered long range and in those cases, power is really the only thing I would be concerned about. There are many wildcats and factory chamberings that will get you to that range with alot of power. As mentioned, the 7mm RUM and 300 RUM are great choices but also are the 7mm Rem Mag, 7mm STW, 7mm Dakota, 300 Win Mag, 300 Wby.
Wildcats, obviously my personal favorites would be my own children. For deer hunting, take your pick, 257 AX, 6.5 AX, 270 AX, 257 AM, 6.5mm AM or 270 AM. All will make 600 yard reach pretty much silly ballistically. Easiest to load for would be the 270 AM and also the highest performing when looking at trajectory and retained energy as well.
You do not need a wildcat however. A 7mm STW or 7mm RUM is what some would call over kill at 600 yards but loaded with the right bullets, when the wind is blowing across a big canyon, the extra Horse power can make the shot if your practiced with the rifle whereas the smaller rounds will often fall short enough to prevent a practical shot to be attemped.
So really, the sky is the limit.
Kirby Allen(50)
