Proof vs Christensen Carbon

[Reload10]

I have a proof barrel and really like it. My only complaint it's that it is very slow.
It's a 24" sendero light chambered in 6.5 GAP and the 140 Bergers struggle to reach 3000+ FPS. And pressure signs are evident on my cases. 60gr of H1000 seems to be the magic recipe, well... not for me. Other than that, it is super accurate, super confortable to carry and as a bonus, it looks super cool.
View attachment 88183

I've read that same issue on other Proof Barrels.

 

[BigGrizz]

So what do you want to know?

As far as Proof or Christensen, just pick one. From what I understand they have different wrapping schemes and techniques, but they've both been out long enough to be proven and satisfactory.

Heat dissipation? Don't know and don't care. I just finished shooting a 25rd string out of my CA 338LM at 1K banging on a steel plate and couldn't have cared less about the barrel getting too hot and throwing rounds. Because it flat wasn't. If it throws a round from a consistent grouping its either me or the muzzle brake has loosened.

I wear my gun out when I take it to the range or wide open plains, and it has yet to let me down.

If you have any ?s let me know. I wont feed you full of BS, and I'll give you what my direct, recent, and current experience has been.

 

[Reload10]

Thanks BigGrizz. Do you ever wish you would have went with a steel barrel? Potential smith has a lot more experience with Brux and Bartlein, and say's they'll accomplish my goals as well.

I'm looking for a lightweight barrel in 26"-28" for my 6.5x284 hunting build.

 

[Pdvdh]

Therefore, it feels cooler to the touch externally, because it does not allow the high heat to transfer that deep to reach the outer layers, but internally it is the same hot temp. That being said, the CF wrapped barrels cool down MUCH faster because there is less steel in them to hold in that heat, and the carbon doesn't hardly absorb any of it.

MR2005,
I don't want to create a big fuss. I endured a number of Heat Transfer courses in college engineering courses. Heat transfer theory doesn't support your last sentence above. Sometimes I wish I didn't know this ****...

The CF is an insulating shield to radial heat loss. The thin steel barrel will heat up faster than a thicker steel barrel - I agree. However, surrounded by the CF insulation wrap, the steel core of the barrel, thick or thin, will retain heat longer than without the insulating CF wrap.

Now, combine a thin walled steel barrel liner and wrap it with CF, and from a strictly heat transfer perspective, the steel core will experience higher temperatures for two reasons: 1) the thinner contour steel barrel/core temperature will rise at an increased rate per shot fired (because of the lesser mass of steel to distribute the heat across - less steel mass) and, 2) the steel barrel/core will cool at a decreased rate (because of the insulating CF wrap).

If I owned a CF barrel, I would be more concerned with steel barrel temperature than I would with a plain steel barrel. I would practice at reduced rates of fire. The only time I'd be banging away at a rapid rate, is if a wounded animal was getting away.

To my way of thinking, the only reason these thinner steel tubes with CF wrap barrels don't shift point of impact unacceptably through their faster heat ups and slower cool downs, is because the CF wrap is exceptionally stiff/rigid. This exceptional rigidity reduces the tendency of the steel barrel to warp during warm up cycles, such that they seem to shoot well - by most all recent reports I read.

If there's a heat transfer expert in the membership that wants to jump in here and identify the flaw in my post, please do. Open invitation... I don't expect anyone, or any CF wrapped barrel manufacturer's rep, will be able to dispute what I've just presented - at least not applying valid heat transfer science.

I'm not trying to say CR wrapped barrels don't or couldn't have some advantages. The advantages I see are reduced weight, better balance, increased barrel stiffness. I am stating they have no thermal efficiency advantages. They're worse than steel barrels, if we desire barrels that heat slower and cool faster.

For what it's worth. I've never believed the improved thermal performance marketing on any CF barrel. Any more than I've ever believed that some rifles shoot more accurately (better precision) at greater distances than they do at closer distances. It's that clear in my mind. Ain't gonna happen. Not until someone develops a functional miniature guidance system, implants it inside a bullet, and the bullet can self-correct it's flight path after it leaves the muzzle.

 

[Pdvdh]

Heat dissipation? Don't know and don't care. I just finished shooting a 25rd string out of my CA 338LM at 1K banging on a steel plate and couldn't have cared less about the barrel getting too hot and throwing rounds. Because it flat wasn't...

If you have any ?s let me know. I wont feed you full of BS, and I'll give you what my direct, recent, and current experience has been.

I have some questions? How did you determine your barrel temperature? You stated it flat wasn't getting too hot. By feeling the exterior of the carbon wrap? Of by feeling the interior of the bore? Temperature sensing instrument?

 

[BigGrizz]

Thanks BigGrizz. Do you ever wish you would have went with a steel barrel? Potential smith has a lot more experience with Brux and Bartlein, and say's they'll accomplish my goals as well.

I'm looking for a lightweight barrel in 26"-28" for my 6.5x284 hunting build.

Do I wish I would have went steel? No, not at all. I have plenty of steel barreled rifles. Is there a difference in performance ballistically? Highly doubt it. I bought this CA rifle for a purpose and it serves it. Any other 338LM with an analogous setup would weigh much more than what mine does. Weight savings is the biggest advantage and the main reason I went the route I did.

If you're more comfortable with Brux or Bartlein then go for it. CF wrapped barrels are solid performers in my experience. That applies to accuracy and heating issues. Engineering and materials science says CF insulates more? Ok. Mathematics and statistics also said Hillary would get elected.

All I know is I would set my CF barreled hunting rifle next to a traditionally tubed gun and go shot for shot without hesitation. Would I buy another CA gun? Yes. I definitely want one of their new .308 MPRs in 16".

If your smith is more comfortable working with steel over carbon I would definitely consider his advice and expertise. I would also say Bitcoin is a bubble, but the technology ain't goin nowhere. If you catch my drift. Do solid research, and make a simple pro/con list if you have too. Nothing helps decision making sometimes like getting back to basics with a little pro/con & cost/benefit analysis.

Feel free to shoot me a PM too

 

[Pdvdh]

Mathematics and statistics also said Hillary would get elected.

Bias is what said Hillary would get elected. True statistics removes bias to the extent possible.

 

[Longtooth32]

I've read that same issue on other Proof Barrels.

My 28" Proof carbon barrel is spitting out 140gr bullets @ 3123fps W/O pressure signs with RL26. I have some more rounds loaded to find out were max load is for this powder/cartridge. Cartridge is 6.5x284... The barrel did not copper up at all during the first 100 rounds. I expect the barrel to get a bit faster...

Honest question...what makes a barrel slow? Another hijack but we are still talking about Proof barrels...

 

[BigGrizz]

I have some questions? How did you determine your barrel temperature? You stated it flat wasn't getting too hot. By feeling the exterior of the carbon wrap? Of by feeling the interior of the bore? Temperature sensing instrument?

Please feel free to point out where I said it wasn't getting too hot. I stated it flat wasn't throwing rounds. But continue your critique or whatever line you were taking.

Edit: Incorrect punctuation

 

[BigGrizz]

Bias is what said Hillary would get elected. True statistics removes bias to the extent possible.

Show me the bias in the quantitative and statistical methodology. I'll gladly wait.

 

[Longtooth32]

I have some questions? How did you determine your barrel temperature? You stated it flat wasn't getting too hot. By feeling the exterior of the carbon wrap? Of by feeling the interior of the bore? Temperature sensing instrument?

Being that this is my first carbon wrapped barrel and I only have 100 rounds the tube...The carbon portions of the barrel hardly got warm. I had to touch the barrel at the barrelnut/receiver juction and even the metal end cap of the barrel to get any idea how hot I was getting the barrel. The metal parts never got too warm to touch...unlike my all metal barrels...

 

[Longtooth32]

Thanks BigGrizz. Do you ever wish you would have went with a steel barrel? Potential smith has a lot more experience with Brux and Bartlein, and say's they'll accomplish my goals as well.

I'm looking for a lightweight barrel in 26"-28" for my 6.5x284 hunting build.

Get an action that will take pre-fit barrels and you will not have to worry about your smith...

I have a long action 6.5x284 with a 28" Proof Research barrel with a barrel nut...I am never going back to an all steel barrel for a hunting rig...

 

[Pdvdh]

... couldn't have cared less about the barrel getting too hot and throwing rounds. Because it flat wasn't. If it throws a round from a consistent grouping its either me or the muzzle brake has loosened.

The and means your "it flat wasn't" statement is inclusive of both "getting too hot and throwing rounds". Your text, not mine. You can go back and edit that grammatical error if you only meant to state if wasn't throwing rounds.

 

[BigGrizz]

The and means your "it flat wasn't" statement is inclusive of both "getting too hot and throwing rounds". Your text, not mine. You can go back and edit that grammatical error if you only meant to state if wasn't throwing rounds.

Meh...I'll leave it the way it is.