Maximum lethal range-175 elite hunter

[xsn10s]

 

[xsn10s]

Velocity is part of the energy, kinetic energy, equation.

 

[Ckleeves]

So can a bullet have more energy and do less damage? Or is energy directly related to damage? Or is energy pretty much irrelevant when it comes to killing critters?

 

[xsn10s]

Bullet manufacturers set minimum velocity for expansion criteria. You'll then need mass of the bullet to measure the energy at impact. Bullet mushrooming or fragmentation will cause trauma, which is dependent on bullet construction. If you have say a 45 cal bullet with large meplat and mass then you're going to get energy transfer, buku amounts of energy transfer.

 

[elkaholic]

Just curious on what you guys think of for determining maximum lethal range. I'm using the 175 berger elite hunter bullet. What is the best factor to look at for down range performance? Is it the impact velocity or energy and how much of either is sufficient for elk?

I would say that the bullet expanding properly is more important than either. I know guys have taken elk at 1100 yards with the 175 out of my 7SS

 

[jraulsten]

I would argue the exact opposite. Energy really means nothing. If the particular bullet has enough velocity to expand/upset that's what dictates performance. A 300 gr bullet going 1400 fps will leave a lot smaller wound channel then a 100 gr bullet going 2200 even though the 300 has more energy.

Depend on the type of bullet....

 

[xsn10s]

So can a bullet have more energy and do less damage? Or is energy directly related to damage? Or is energy pretty much irrelevant when it comes to killing critters?

Seems like you're trying a strawman's argument to prove a point.

 

[Ckleeves]

Depend on the type of bullet....

Yes it does… I should have put that.

 

[ResearchinStuff]

Bullet mass is a fixed value during a shot because we aren't pushing a given projectile fast enough to ablate material off as they travel downrange.

for a given bullet, velocity is the variable that's actually changing during travel, so it's the one that makes sense to compare as you're evaluating effective range.

between bullets of different construction, ke is irrelevant for predicting tissue damage, because bullet construction + impact velocity determines the wound profile. Fmjs do less damage than fragmenting bullets, even if they have more energy. This is very easy to demonstrate for yourself.

So, yeah, ke is irrelevant. It is pointless for discussing a single bullet (why multiply by constants) and doesn't tell you anything about the killing differences between bullets.

 

[xsn10s]

Wouldn't you need velocity? You can have a ton (literally) of energy and have zero fragmentation or mushrooming.

So in the case of a FMJ with lots of velocity generally speaking it'll pencil through on game. So there won't be much energy transfer On steel plates it'll transfer all of it's energy if it comes apart on the plate. In say a Berger Elite Hunter then you'll typically get fragmentation within the velocity parameters of 1800 fps on impact on game. That fragmentation is part of the KE transfer to whatever it hits. Velocity and mass are part of the KE formula. So it part of the formula for trauma as is bullet construction.

 

[dogz]

Take a decent bullet, one that will open up at the ranges you're willing to take a shot that you know you will dunk!

Put it in the right place, said bullet needs enough speed to open and shred the lungs. Once the lungs are toast so is the volunteer.

Killing just isn't rocket science not matter how hard we try to make it!

Back in Jr High I didn't know any diff and fawned over energy tables. Haven't looked one since 9th grade....

Last years elk I took with my 22/250 and a 63 Sierra @ 300 yds. In behind the front left, lungs went thru the vegimatic and the bullet exited low on the shoulder. Said elk went down toot sweet!

Not rocket science

The 175 in question will work to dang long range, most likely at least 2x as far as most of us have the capability to use it to.

 

[jraulsten]

I over simplified my original post to make a point I wasn't very clear on. I think we all understand bullet construction and which ones to use for hunting.....

You need penetration for the bullet to do its job. Yes velocity matters because it's obviously a part of the energy equation, but just one part. When you are talking about penetration you have two things in play, momentum and energy. Momentum keeps the bullet moving but energy is what breaks tissue and bone to allow the bullet to move.

Not worth arguing about.....I don't have a problem killing whatever I shoot at

 

[wasskeet]

Energy is irrelevant?

FWIW, I think I read it in one of Peter Hathaway Capsticks' book's - but he stated in effect that all that energy (1800ft-lbs or whatever amount) isn't falling out of the sky, but from 1 foot. He noted that was to be considered when drawing a bead on a 10,000 lb. elephant with even a .470 Nitro double.

 

[FEENIX]

I over simplified my original post to make a point I wasn't very clear on. I think we all understand bullet construction and which ones to use for hunting.....

You need penetration for the bullet to do its job. Yes velocity matters because it's obviously a part of the energy equation, but just one part. When you are talking about penetration you have two things in play, momentum and energy. Momentum keeps the bullet moving but energy is what breaks tissue and bone to allow the bullet to move.

Not worth arguing about.....I don't have a problem killing whatever I shoot at

Now you know why I responded as such.

I borrowed this from a friend...

Trying to throw that badminton birdy as hard as they can at the target when they could just toss a rock instead.