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Reloading
Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video
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<blockquote data-quote="BountyHunter" data-source="post: 993675" data-attributes="member: 12"><p><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 12px"> </span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">He</span></span><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">re is an explanation of how I <strong>ladder</strong> test step by step.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">My methodology is pretty similar after I have done basic research to determine, bullet,primer, and powder combo I want to use/test for each <strong>ladder</strong>. Now this might be many reloading manuals, others recommended loads, Qload, etc, but I find a "suspected" powder, primer, bullet and case and then work a load that is normally about 2-5 grains below max to 1-2 grains over at .2 to .4 increments depending on case size. Normally this is 15-25 bullets only with 4-5 extra of the lowest charge for initial zero on the other target.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">I use the smaller increments as I am looking for a node that often is only .5 to max 1.0 wide and this gives me a easier way to determine it.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">1. Shoot ONLY in early morning or evening in no wind conditions.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">2. Minimum of 300 yards prefer 400. I have found that seems to be the ideal distance for enough vertical dispersion as the bullets walk up and close enough to see each separate bullet impact with good spotting scope on white target. Shorter makes it to difficult to determine impacts and longer makes it too difficult again to see any impacts.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">3. 35P chrono is used. This is absolutely key. Brian Litz's new book confirms why the Oehlers are the best chromos.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">4. Minature paper target at bench to plot each round and another sheet to write down each MV for each round. That way I do not lose track of any bullet shot as each is numbered on plot sheet and anytime I go down range to verify impact. I also mark each shot on the 35 P paper as it is shot.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">5. Minimum of 1 minute between shots from starting dirty bore, I usually zero at that distance on another target at the side to confirm accurate zero for bottom of <strong>ladder</strong> target which is normally large plain white cardboard with 1" aiming dot near bottom. I use .3 grain for large cases and .2 for smaller cases as increments. </span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">6. If I am not 100% sure of bullet location, I either walk down or I often use use colored magic markers (4-5 colors) alternating on bullet tips which show up on target. No they will not vary impact points on target. That is used all the time at 1K BR to identify any crossfires on your target.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">7. MV as you go up will be linear (ie roughly same FPS each bullet) until you hit a node and then it tends to decrease dramatically for that 2-4 shots and then jump linear again. You will see 3-4 rds with small MV variances normally in the node and then jump dramatically again. You can see on a magnum a jump of 20 FPS and then 3 bullets around 6-8 fps along then it will jump again back to around 20. This is only an example, not always. </span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><strong><em>Combination of bullet AND MV grouping confirms node</em></strong> and is usually easy to see when you compare the two!! You will have multiple bullets with similar vertical impacts and very low dispersion on MV.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">8. I pick a middle node, shoot groups to confirm basic accuracy and ES, SD nodes. I normally find two, maybe three nodes, and one will be in the MV range I am looking for. Many times the top one is at the starting of high pressure point, so often do not use that one. Middle of the node gives me enough variance on temps and other factors that I am not out of the node on any given day. I do not focus on the lowest ES/SD. Once I find a node then it is an "acceptable ES/SD and tight grouping that is confirmed. I normally shoot for single digit ideally but low teens is acceptable with the grouping.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">I determine pressure by case head expansion measured with a blade micrometer, primers (but not always accurate as some are softer than others and can be misleading), sticky bolth etc. It is a combination of everything that leads me to determine I am at high pressure. I take it until I see firm signs of pressure and then stop even if I have not shot all the shots IF I am at an acceptable MV and see good nodes.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">9. I then try groups at various seating depths at my best grouping and see what depth it likes. For a single shot gun start, .010 in the lands and come out. Magazine gun, start at max magazine COAL and in from there. I start .010 in, come out at .030, .050, .080 and .120 IF a single shot gun. One will be much tighter and then work in between to find the place normally down to .010. </span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">10. If the gun will not shoot 1 MOA, that makes shooting a <strong>ladder</strong> a little difficult as you do not know what is the real vertical or 3-4MOA grouping "inability", so IMO it is not for every gun.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">11. If a gun will not shoot with all this, then another <strong>ladder</strong> with another powder or bullet combo.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 12px"> </span></span></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="BountyHunter, post: 993675, member: 12"] [FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3] [/SIZE][/FONT] [COLOR=black][FONT="Verdana"]He[/FONT][/COLOR][FONT="Verdana"]re is an explanation of how I [COLOR=windowtext][B]ladder[/B][/COLOR] test step by step. My methodology is pretty similar after I have done basic research to determine, bullet,primer, and powder combo I want to use/test for each [COLOR=windowtext][B]ladder[/B][/COLOR]. Now this might be many reloading manuals, others recommended loads, Qload, etc, but I find a "suspected" powder, primer, bullet and case and then work a load that is normally about 2-5 grains below max to 1-2 grains over at .2 to .4 increments depending on case size. Normally this is 15-25 bullets only with 4-5 extra of the lowest charge for initial zero on the other target. I use the smaller increments as I am looking for a node that often is only .5 to max 1.0 wide and this gives me a easier way to determine it. 1. Shoot ONLY in early morning or evening in no wind conditions. 2. Minimum of 300 yards prefer 400. I have found that seems to be the ideal distance for enough vertical dispersion as the bullets walk up and close enough to see each separate bullet impact with good spotting scope on white target. Shorter makes it to difficult to determine impacts and longer makes it too difficult again to see any impacts. 3. 35P chrono is used. This is absolutely key. Brian Litz's new book confirms why the Oehlers are the best chromos. 4. Minature paper target at bench to plot each round and another sheet to write down each MV for each round. That way I do not lose track of any bullet shot as each is numbered on plot sheet and anytime I go down range to verify impact. I also mark each shot on the 35 P paper as it is shot. 5. Minimum of 1 minute between shots from starting dirty bore, I usually zero at that distance on another target at the side to confirm accurate zero for bottom of [COLOR=windowtext][B]ladder[/B][/COLOR] target which is normally large plain white cardboard with 1" aiming dot near bottom. I use .3 grain for large cases and .2 for smaller cases as increments. 6. If I am not 100% sure of bullet location, I either walk down or I often use use colored magic markers (4-5 colors) alternating on bullet tips which show up on target. No they will not vary impact points on target. That is used all the time at 1K BR to identify any crossfires on your target. 7. MV as you go up will be linear (ie roughly same FPS each bullet) until you hit a node and then it tends to decrease dramatically for that 2-4 shots and then jump linear again. You will see 3-4 rds with small MV variances normally in the node and then jump dramatically again. You can see on a magnum a jump of 20 FPS and then 3 bullets around 6-8 fps along then it will jump again back to around 20. This is only an example, not always. [B][I]Combination of bullet AND MV grouping confirms node[/I][/B] and is usually easy to see when you compare the two!! You will have multiple bullets with similar vertical impacts and very low dispersion on MV. 8. I pick a middle node, shoot groups to confirm basic accuracy and ES, SD nodes. I normally find two, maybe three nodes, and one will be in the MV range I am looking for. Many times the top one is at the starting of high pressure point, so often do not use that one. Middle of the node gives me enough variance on temps and other factors that I am not out of the node on any given day. I do not focus on the lowest ES/SD. Once I find a node then it is an "acceptable ES/SD and tight grouping that is confirmed. I normally shoot for single digit ideally but low teens is acceptable with the grouping. I determine pressure by case head expansion measured with a blade micrometer, primers (but not always accurate as some are softer than others and can be misleading), sticky bolth etc. It is a combination of everything that leads me to determine I am at high pressure. I take it until I see firm signs of pressure and then stop even if I have not shot all the shots IF I am at an acceptable MV and see good nodes. 9. I then try groups at various seating depths at my best grouping and see what depth it likes. For a single shot gun start, .010 in the lands and come out. Magazine gun, start at max magazine COAL and in from there. I start .010 in, come out at .030, .050, .080 and .120 IF a single shot gun. One will be much tighter and then work in between to find the place normally down to .010. 10. If the gun will not shoot 1 MOA, that makes shooting a [COLOR=windowtext][B]ladder[/B][/COLOR] a little difficult as you do not know what is the real vertical or 3-4MOA grouping "inability", so IMO it is not for every gun. 11. If a gun will not shoot with all this, then another [COLOR=windowtext][B]ladder[/B][/COLOR] with another powder or bullet combo.[/FONT] [FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3] [/SIZE][/FONT] [/QUOTE]
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Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video
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