How do we deal with some of the realities of our sport?

[MontanaRifleman]

When I typed "antis", I meant LRH antis, not tree hugging antis.

To play devils advocate, just because I don't publicize everything I do doesn't mean that I am ashamed, hiding or lying. Sometimes I pass to avoid unproductive confrontation although as many of you know I can be outspoken about some things.

So far most of the posts reflect my onion on the subject of LRH... BUT... as I said before, we are seeing this through our own eyes and preaching to the choir.

Is discretion sometimes a wiser choice?

Do the befits of being completely open out weigh the possible negative impact?

Let's take Facebook for instance. I am on FB and I have no problem posting hunting pics of dead animals... however, I would not post autopsy and bloody pics because I know it would offend some of my friends. A very few of my friends are anti-hunting and some others are indifferent. Any hunting pics would be offensive to the ones who are anti, but I draw the line at posting the "cleaner" pics. Posting the gorier pics might offend the more neutral friends and I choose not to do that although the reality is that hunting is a bloody sport.

Some folks need some time to adjust and come around and force feeding can be counter productive.

On the other site I was talking about, I have chosen to be selective about what I post but I do occasionally push the limit a little without stirring the pot too much. The general trend is that many of the members of that site are coming around slowly to the acceptable idea of long range hunting... but not all.

Now this site is in fact dedicated to LRH, so I would be much more free in what I post here... but are there ANY "wise" boundaries?

I have no problem with the video. The question is does it do more harm than good? Will it alienate those who are less knowledgeable and experienced and haven't really made a decision?

 

[farout]

Enjoyed the video very much and it was very educational for me. Thought both shooter and spotter worked great together to make those shots happen. Definitely a team effort going there.

I, myself have not had the opportunity to take a game animal at long range. But I practice relentlessly, for that opportunity. Rocks shutter when in my crosshairs at 900 or so yards.

So I find videos like this educational and will help me in making the right decisions when that time comes. I do not think we should edit out just to appease anti hunters. We have the right to watch and they have the right not to watch.


I think most hunters who have issues with long range hunting feel that the long shot is making the whole sport of hunting too easy and allows the killing of game that may have otherwise escaped. They feel that fewer tags will be available due to increased success. I always say to them, "Fine, why not lay down the rifle and pick up the bow, or lay down the bow and pick up the spear." They usually change their mind when their tool of choice is under attack. Truth is humans always incorporate newer technology when available. That's how we went from rocks, to spears, to bows, to guns in the first place.

 

[bigngreen]

I have no problem with the video. The question is does it do more harm than good? Will it alienate those who are less knowledgeable and experienced and haven't really made a decision?

I think it's our comments or interpretation of the video that do the harm, those who don't know what their seeing but have not made their mind up before hitting the play button will interrupt the results by our comments.

 

[Nimrod]

Those who are against it are usually both ignorant of the sport and fundamentally against the idea of it. In my experience they do not listen to facts, experience and reason. They choose to remain ignorant.

If they choose to remain ignorant so be it.

I sorta have mixed feelings on the video and editing too but the fact remains that a young boy killed a bull moose and he has every right to be proud and so does his family. He hung in there and got the job done and that is what matters, IMHO. None of us are perfect but it is important to strive for perfection. In truth, I would rather see the whole video than just a kill shot but that is me. I think the anti long range crowd can be lumped together with the anti crossbow crowd or any other group of antis. I am generally a live and let live sort of guy, I don't believe that we have the right to tell other folks what they choose to do is wrong or unethical. If it's legal I'm okay with it, I may choose not to do it but that is a choice I will make for myself.

I don't feel a need to apologize to anyone for the things I do, nor do I feel any obligation to be "politically correct" I don't harvest animals, I kill them. I try to do it humanely and I try to be respectful and responsible about it. I don't offend others on purpose but I refuse to walk on eggshells trying to coddle ignorant people into accepting me.

I came to this forum to learn to do something I was interested in and I am doing just that (perhaps a bit slow on the uptake) and I'm grateful to all of you who have shared the knowledge and experience that allows me to do so. Including pictures and videos.

Bob

 

[WildRose]

How in the world could any anti have a problem with that moose hunt? They were all out protesting for the reintroduction of wolves... The Hunt on this Video was 1000 times more ethical then any wolf kill. Hiding and worrying about what a these wildlife illiterate antis think is playing right into their hands... We should never ever be driven underground in the way we hunt or manage wildlife. I feel it was appropriate to post the video just like it was... What message are we sending to the hunter (a young man out on his first moose hunt) that he should hide his hunt and it is something to be ashamed of? If hunters stood together and had nothing to do all day but grease up there lice infected Ragee hair we wouldn't have to be worried about posting a video to the net. But most have to work to support these culls so they have time to protest, learn to howl like wolves on the courthouse steps, and make cardboard signs trying wipe out our way of life. I say KUDOS to Bayem for a great video and a bigger KUDOS to his son for a great hunt. jmo Dave Garrett

You have to understand their mentality. "wolf kills" are nature at work, it just has to be done for them to survive. We enjoy hunting, and that's what bothers them. It's ok to kill, you just aren't supposed to enjoy it.

 

[WildRose]

When I typed "antis", I meant LRH antis, not tree hugging antis.

To play devils advocate, just because I don't publicize everything I do doesn't mean that I am ashamed, hiding or lying. Sometimes I pass to avoid unproductive confrontation although as many of you know I can be outspoken about some things.

So far most of the posts reflect my onion on the subject of LRH... BUT... as I said before, we are seeing this through our own eyes and preaching to the choir.

Is discretion sometimes a wiser choice?

Do the befits of being completely open out weigh the possible negative impact?

Let's take Facebook for instance. I am on FB and I have no problem posting hunting pics of dead animals... however, I would not post autopsy and bloody pics because I know it would offend some of my friends. A very few of my friends are anti-hunting and some others are indifferent. Any hunting pics would be offensive to the ones who are anti, but I draw the line at posting the "cleaner" pics. Posting the gorier pics might offend the more neutral friends and I choose not to do that although the reality is that hunting is a bloody sport.

Some folks need some time to adjust and come around and force feeding can be counter productive.

On the other site I was talking about, I have chosen to be selective about what I post but I do occasionally push the limit a little without stirring the pot too much. The general trend is that many of the members of that site are coming around slowly to the acceptable idea of long range hunting... but not all.

Now this site is in fact dedicated to LRH, so I would be much more free in what I post here... but are there ANY "wise" boundaries?

I have no problem with the video. The question is does it do more harm than good? Will it alienate those who are less knowledgeable and experienced and haven't really made a decision?

Fair points but this isn't facebook. This site exists to promote the sport of long range hunting.

To that end I think openness in putting forth as much accurate information we have is completely appropriate.

If someone chooses to come here to be offended that's not our fault.

 

[Broz]

Fair points but this isn't facebook. This site exists to promote the sport of long range hunting.

To that end I think openness in putting forth as much accurate information we have is completely appropriate.

If someone chooses to come here to be offended that's not our fault.

Very valid point!!

Darn WR you are on a roll today...

Jeff

 

[WildRose]

Great point, People alway ask about if I/we watch these long range shows on television. The answer is no, I really try to avoid them. Not knowing how many shots are edited out before they get that one perfect shot. Yes with lots of practice year round in all conditions will give you a huge edge but there is always a factor you can't control that is the main cause of our misses, wind. It's not consistent ever. Ya you can adjust for what it is doing where your at but that isn't what it's doing along the way between you and your target.Ya it's cool to see when they do make a good shot but it's just sad that Most all hunting shows never have a miss aired on there shows. Giving a false hope to everyone who is thinking about starting to hunt.

Hell we've all missed animals at all distances near and far and I guarantee we will all miss again but what separates us is the ones big enough to admit they miss.

True, another major difference is that most of us with a lot of experience not only are willing to admit that we miss, but we can also analyze the conditions and narrow down the reasons as to why we missed.

Think of all the threads here where we are in fact asked to help someone by dissecting what happened as they saw it on their end. We are able to then often help them understand why they missed and what is needed in the future to enable them to make those same shots and or the necessary follow up shots to avoid long tracks and lost game.

 

[WildRose]

Very valid point!!

Darn WR you are on a roll today...

Jeff

I try... .gun)

 

[MontanaRifleman]

Fair points but this isn't facebook. This site exists to promote the sport of long range hunting.

To that end I think openness in putting forth as much accurate information we have is completely appropriate.

If someone chooses to come here to be offended that's not our fault.

True, this site is different than FB and so I have different personal guidelines what I post and don't post on each. So, do you feel the benefit of posting a video like this more beneficial than harmful to the sport?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing that it should not have been posted. I lean more to the idea that it's OK but I still have mixed emotions about it. When I first saw the miss the very first thing I thought was that the anti long rangers will have a field day with this. I know because I have had more than my share of encounters with them.

You and I and the rest of us know things don't always go right in long or short range. But there will be those who look at this and say "see, this is proof you can never be sure of making a clean kill at these ranges" and do their best to convince others of it. Should we just forget and ignore them and let them rant?

 

[500mag_guy]

My longest shot to date was at 1120 yards on a mule deer doe broadside no wide. Calculated everything and took the shot. I had two guys on spotting scopes and they both called about minute high. Instead of adjusting and taking another shot I personally had to figure out what was wrong before i would send the next shot.. She wasn't hit and only spooked a short distance so I went to my calculator and after going through everything a couple times I realized that in the heat of the moment I had forgot to enter my 7* slope. Added up to be 3/4 MOA. Dropped down and sent it off and down she went.

As you said with all of our experience behind the rifle on paper has help us diagnose the problem and take a follow up shot in the field. Yes I could have very easily just followed the call and dropped a minute but for myself figuring out the problem, correcting and making the shot all just adds the the whole experience!

True, another major difference is that most of us with a lot of experience not only are willing to admit that we miss, but we can also analyze the conditions and narrow down the reasons as to why we missed.

Think of all the threads here where we are in fact asked to help someone by dissecting what happened as they saw it on their end. We are able to then often help them understand why they missed and what is needed in the future to enable them to make those same shots and or the necessary follow up shots to avoid long tracks and lost game.

 

[oldmossy]

Someone needs to let me know whether or not to post anymore videos. And whether to show bullet performance picts. I'm beginning to become confused.

The reason I'm on this site is to learn from others and have proof of their experience if they so decide to show it in video form. I want to see bullet affects. I thoroughly enjoy when Broz posts his hunting stories and poeple like him.

I personally don't care if it offends another or not. I'm actually sorta feed up with how people constantly have to change to make another happy.

If I don't like something on television, I turn the channel. If I don't like things on this forum, I'll change forums.

My two cents-- keep the stories, info, videos,pictures coming. I won't be offended.

 

[oldmossy]

And most importantly-- post the truth! If it takes a half dozen shots to hit it,then I also don't believe you should be shooting at it. Just because you miss, or it takes more than one shot to anchor the animal doesnt constitute altering video to make it acceptable in anothers eyes. I prefer seeing it the way it happened.

 

[500mag_guy]

Someone needs to let me know whether or not to post anymore videos. And whether to show bullet performance picts. I'm beginning to become confused.

The reason I'm on this site is to learn from others and have proof of their experience if they so decide to show it in video form. I want to see bullet affects. I thoroughly enjoy when Broz posts his hunting stories and poeple like him.

I personally don't care if it offends another or not. I'm actually sorta feed up with how people constantly have to change to make another happy.

If I don't like something on television, I turn the channel. If I don't like things on this forum, I'll change forums.

My two cents-- keep the stories, info, videos,pictures coming. I won't be offended.

+1 I think everyone needs to keep posting all videos pictures, etc!!

I think everything is moving away from what the op may have intended this thread for.