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Hornady marketing

I was just thinking about something, I was raised to hunt by my grandfather and my Uncle Jim. Grandfather used a 1917 Parker SxS with 34" barrels choked extra full/extra full and Uncle Jim had 2 rifles that I knew about, both Weatherby Mark Vs in 240 Weatherby and 257 Weatherby and he always preached to me that a SP bonded bullet would kill anything and everything needed killing. He traveled all over the world, took me moose, elk, sheep, antelope, mule deer and whitetail hunting and I used both of those rifles. He passed away in 1986 after a lengthy battle with cancer, my aunt Lillian gave me those two rifles the day we buried him. There's not a bit of finish on the 240 and a good portion is missing on the 257. We never found his stash of ammo, if he had one. I didn't use a tipped bullet until the late 90s early 2000s, for the ranges I hunted back then, my favorite bullet was a Winchester Super-X Power-Point for the 30'06 and 243. I used a Weatherby loaded SP of some kind in the Win-Tuff XTR 300 Weatherby that I killed my first bull elk with, got the elk and 13 stitches over my right eye. I think there was as much or more blood on me as the elk, angles and such, valuable lesson.

My first "ballistic tip" outing was disastrous, I shot a big for our area 9 point, saw the hit/splash, but never recovered the deer. At the time, we attributed the failure to a combination of things, too close a range, too much velocity and poor placement(too far forward on the shoulder/scapula). I am not saying that a SP would have had a different outcome, but up until that point, I had never failed to recover a game animal shot with a soft point.

My first and only outing with Hornady tipped bullets was the ELD-X, 3 shots, 3 different outcomes, huge wound channel on a doe shot over 300yds, pencil in and pencil out on a buck shot at approximately 100yds and perfect performance on a buck at 140yds, all 3 from a 300 WSM. This was early in the history of the ELD line, maybe it was an unfair assessment, but I haven't been back down that road and don't plan to.

I will say that of all the bullets on the shelf during covid, I could find Hornady at several retailers in various calibers, excluding 6.5mm and 7mm.

I use Berger, Nosler and Barnes primarily, but I have built up a solid stash of soft points in 224, 6.5mm, 7mm and 308, Bergers in all 4 and 6mm.

I don't know if Hornady figured it out or stumbled onto the solution, doesn't matter, don't care.

There are accurate bullets from a variety of manufacturers in various shapes and sizes, it's conceivable, revolutionary, doubtful since HP and SPs were already in wide use.

Hornady did give us rubber tipped bullets for our lever guns, never figured that one out or used one.
 
Something else I experienced with Hornady is inconsistent "Match" ammunition. I had bought some of the 108 gr ELD-M for the 6mm Creedmoor and was getting 1/4 moa groups at 100 yards with my favorite rifle. I ordered another case since I was getting low and couldn't do better than 3/4 moa. I pulled apart a cartridge from each lot and it was obvious the powder was different. I've been thinking about this and my take is Hornady was more interested in selling the product than matching any sort of accurate load. They just wanted to keep the $$ coming in.
If you have a reloading scale, weight the cartridges and write the weight on the case with a sharpie. Separate by weight and shoot those and you will see that 1/4" group return and maybe a tad tighter. My buddy bought ten boxes of 7 mag Precision Ammo and weighed the rounds and his rifle will shoot 1/4 or less all day long.
 
This worries me a little bit. When my kestrel gets updated with the new tip, will my BCs for the Hornady bullets be off? I bought a lot of them for a couple of rifles so I wouldn't run out. Are there going to be an ELD-X/M flat tip and round tip options?

Berger had it right the whole time? Maybe I have plenty of the 195 EOLs that I've pushed to the side because the tips are different and more pointed than the others. The longer and more deformed the tip is the less chance I have of fitting it in my magazine. I've been looking at getting some bullets with the MRT (Meplat Reduction Technology) for some of my rifles because I've noticed that a lot of the Berger tips are different from bullet to bullet, even out of the same box.

I'll also say this; I avoided using Hornady bullets for a long time. I was always a Nosler guy. With the way they've raised their prices compared to other companies, I can no longer support Nosler. I still have a lot of their bullets and will continue to shoot them but, I won't be buying anymore. Anything that I get anymore is either in a red or yellow box, It sorta just depends on the cartridge and the bullet that I want to use, along with availability.
Typically, it will be separate if it's a different bullet.
If it's replacing the ELDs, as they are designed now, then it will be like the AMAX. In which case, yes, you will have to redo your ballistic profile.

That said, a friendly word of advice, just use the published custom drags…they are more accurate for the duration of the bullet flight and easier to tune. Best things is you don't need multiple profiles for different machs like you do with BC.

Hornady uses Doppler radar to come up with their numbers. So does ABs lab. Then you'll have the mobile lab results for some custom rifles too.

You'll definitely have bullet support with whatever they are selling with AB and the numbers are third partied, if you don't believe the advertised numbers are real.
 
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Typically, it will be separate if it's a different bullet.
If it's replacing the ELDs, as they are now, then it will be like the AMAX. In which case, yes, you will have to redo your ballistic profile.

That said, a friendly word of advice, just use the published custom drags…they are more accurate for the duration of the bullet flight and easier to tune. Best things is you don't need multiple profiles for different machs like you do with BC.

Hornady uses Doppler radar to come up with their numbers. So does ABs lab. Then you'll have the mobile lab results for some custom rifles too.

You'll definitely have bullet support with whatever they are selling with AB and the numbers are third partied, if you don't believe the advertised numbers are real.
I've had good luck just using the AB custom curve, that doesn't actually show a BC. I was really impressed with this feature. Time will tell what AB says in it's data, I just home its discernable.
 
I don't understand all the Hornady hate.

Hornady has done more than any other company, including Berger, to advance the shooting/hunting industry in the last decade plus.

You can choose to believe they are "lying" to the general public, inspite of the fact that they spend boocoo money on R&D, and actually do a pretty good job of developing product.

In fact, they have give. Berger a run for their money in the LR arena with their product development and product advancement.

I'm glad Hornady has the R&D team they have as well as their marketing strategies.
 
I don't understand all the hate, buy it or don't. I use some of the products no complaints.
The hate is because the truth seems a very distant factor in what Hornady dabble in the guise as marketing.
Their bullets vary in ogive length more than ANY bullet I have seen marketed as 'Match'. Heck, even Speer TNT hollow points vary less than Hornady…

Cheers.
 
Fair enough. I don't care what the pitch is, meets my intended requirements, I'll use it. Play no favorites. But you have to admit, the hate is real.
I don't think it is hate. It is a strong call out for using misleading test results coming from some what crude components and making a blanket statement to market a product, leading followers to believe that is as good as it gets. Then only giving a very small acknowledgement "this is are results from are testing" your results may vary. Your groups are to small? not if you consider all the data collected in developing a load. You are going to have large group dispersion? Yes you are, but it can be greatly reduced by the quality of your components, reloading skills and willingness to test. They dismiss turners? But then admit and recommend changing muzzle brakes and cans to tighten groups. Factory ammo could be better/more consistent, by tightening specs, weights and measurements, but that would be costly. The call out comes from those that create better ammo by doing the things mentioned above and know that a lot of the little thing, Neck tension, seating depth, annealing. precise powder and length measurements etc. along with a well tuned capable rifle, can shrink groups and that there are reasons for "flyers". Not everyone wants or needs the benefits of this precise accuracy, but the way hornady so casually dismisses it fly's in the face of those that do. Not everyone nerds out on this stuff, but for those that do it is where the fun is. And for those that can go out and buy a factory rifle with store bought ammo, sight it in and go out and just enjoy shooting/hunting, I sometime envy you and in no way look down on your gear. The constant drive to improve what is possible is not for all but for some is a passion. Which ever side or even in between you fall on enjoy the sport.
 
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