my 105 and 115 ARE the Hunting VLD's and they still suck, good for punching paper and ringing steel only. By the way, I shot a 150 class whitetail buck at 348 yards two years ago, held for the front shoulder, he dropped at the shot, as he was lying close to a prairie trail in my pasture I watched him for 2 or 3 minutes, saw no signs of life, walked back to my truck and drove around to where he went down, from shot to my getting there was 5 to 7 minutes, he wasn't there when I got there, I walked up the hill so I could see better and found him about 75 yards from where he went down - still alive, he got up but could only make it 30 or 40 yards before going down again, finished him with a neck shot, when I butchered him the bullet hole was through the scapula. Again anybody want to buy some Bergers?