advice for an ill-shooting remington xcr tactical l/r

[benchracer]

I bought a new Winchester model 70 extreme weather in 300 win mag based on the recommendation of 2 Scheels associates. I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER EXPENSIVE FACTORY RIFLE AGAIN!!! This rifle would only shoot 2 1/4 to 4 inch groups with 6 different factory ammos. I have since found a good gunsmith and had him put on a match grade barrel, bedded the stock, put on a Timney trigger and lap the lugs. I'm working on a hand load to get me between 3/8 and 3/4 inch groups. I think the only way to go is to buy a cheap rifle for the action and have a smith put on a new barrel, trigger and stock. I've heard too many stories of guys getting poor shooting rifles from the factory and the gun companies won't do anything to fix them. Its a really big roll of the dice to get a factory gun that will shoot well. Some will say that Savage or Tikka are accurate right out of the box. I couldn't get a Savage in a 110 FCP HS Precision and didn't want a 6.75 pound Tikka in a 300 win mag.

Just my $.02 worth.

I don't blame you for feeling that way. It's that sort of situation that pushes people toward custom actions/rifles. Most of my rifles are builds rather than off-the-shelf purchases. Most of my builds have been comparable in cost to off-the-shelf rifles, but I get a much higher quality barrel and better parts fitting in the process.

It's interesting that you had problems with one of the new production Extreme Weather Model 70's. EVERY accuracy complaint I have seen involving a new production Model 70 has involved a Stainless model. It makes me wonder if FN has a different source for the stainless barrels than they do for the chrome moly ones. I have a standard Model 70 Sporter that shoots right with my rifles wearing custom barrels. Overall, I feel that the current production Model 70's are some of the best factory rifles being made. What I am seeing would make me steer away from a stainless Model 70, though.

 

[skeeterboud]

Gary(trckymsft), i could not tell if the barrel's i.d. changed, as the amount of resistance seemed constant while running a patch. neither could i say any of the brass had imperfections. since i've already remounted the base/rings/re-torqued the action screws, i spent a crap load more $$$$ on ammo, and shot a few groups of 3 of my handloads.

Barne's 180 ttsx factory 3 shot groups 1.75" 1.75"
Federal 180 nos. part fact 3 shot grps 2.125" 1.75"
handloads imr4350/fed primer/horn brass 66-69gr 1.5" 1.75" 1.75" 2.5" 2.75" and 1.0"

ran out of daylight, so i have a few more to shoot, and will load some more 68gr that resulted in 1.0" group(the best this thing has ever produced)

should i change primers? i currently have rl-15/17/19/22/25 imr7828/4350

any recommendations? i have yet to find hsm 210vld factory ammo in stock. i'm going to send this back to remmy after one more trip to the range.

 

[Mike 338]

I bought a new Winchester model 70 extreme weather in 300 win mag based on the recommendation of 2 Scheels associates. I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER EXPENSIVE FACTORY RIFLE AGAIN!!! This rifle would only shoot 2 1/4 to 4 inch groups with 6 different factory ammos. I have since found a good gunsmith and had him put on a match grade barrel, bedded the stock, put on a Timney trigger and lap the lugs. I'm working on a hand load to get me between 3/8 and 3/4 inch groups. I think the only way to go is to buy a cheap rifle for the action and have a smith put on a new barrel, trigger and stock. I've heard too many stories of guys getting poor shooting rifles from the factory and the gun companies won't do anything to fix them. Its a really big roll of the dice to get a factory gun that will shoot well. Some will say that Savage or Tikka are accurate right out of the box. I couldn't get a Savage in a 110 FCP HS Precision and didn't want a 6.75 pound Tikka in a 300 win mag.

Just my $.02 worth.

That's pretty much my story with a Winchester Extreme Weather in 338 Win Mag. I'm fairly disgusted.

 

[Trickymissfit]

Gary(trckymsft), i could not tell if the barrel's i.d. changed, as the amount of resistance seemed constant while running a patch. neither could i say any of the brass had imperfections. since i've already remounted the base/rings/re-torqued the action screws, i spent a crap load more $$$$ on ammo, and shot a few groups of 3 of my handloads.

Barne's 180 ttsx factory 3 shot groups 1.75" 1.75"
Federal 180 nos. part fact 3 shot grps 2.125" 1.75"
handloads imr4350/fed primer/horn brass 66-69gr 1.5" 1.75" 1.75" 2.5" 2.75" and 1.0"

ran out of daylight, so i have a few more to shoot, and will load some more 68gr that resulted in 1.0" group(the best this thing has ever produced)

should i change primers? i currently have rl-15/17/19/22/25 imr7828/4350

any recommendations? i have yet to find hsm 210vld factory ammo in stock. i'm going to send this back to remmy after one more trip to the range.

I'm beginning to think the bedding is bad. It ought to shoot much better than that!
gary

 

[angus-5024]

I'm surprised that nobody else has suggested bedding the action.

so check list would go as such:
1- freefloat barrel
2-bed the stock
3- torque the action screws to proper specs!
4- check the crown.

I HIGHLY doubt that you got a lemon. I have had so many "lemons" come through my hands that I worked into solid rifles (3/4 MOA or better).

5- Start hand loading!!! If you have the money to put a match grade barrel on it, you have money to reload. even with the most basic hand loaders tools (like I have), your rifle can shoot well.

 

[skeeterboud]

well, i'd like to follow up in thanks for all of the help/suggestions. Ended up taking the rig to mg arms in spring, had is glass bedded and had the lugs squared. saw a fairly impressive gain in accuracy, with all ammo, both factory and reloads.
Barne's 180 ttsx factory 3 shot groups 1.75" 1.75"(before)-- 1.5" 1.25" after
Federal 180 nos. part fact 3 shot grps 2.125" 1.75"-- did not shoot
handloads imr4350/fed primer/horn brass 66-69gr 1.5" 1.75" 1.75" 2.5" 2.75" and 1.0" ---1.0" 1.50" 1.5" 1.75" 1.75" and .75"!!

guess i'm going to play w/different primers and try 4831..next

 

[Trickymissfit]

well, i'd like to follow up in thanks for all of the help/suggestions. Ended up taking the rig to mg arms in spring, had is glass bedded and had the lugs squared. saw a fairly impressive gain in accuracy, with all ammo, both factory and reloads.
Barne's 180 ttsx factory 3 shot groups 1.75" 1.75"(before)-- 1.5" 1.25" after
Federal 180 nos. part fact 3 shot grps 2.125" 1.75"-- did not shoot
handloads imr4350/fed primer/horn brass 66-69gr 1.5" 1.75" 1.75" 2.5" 2.75" and 1.0" ---1.0" 1.50" 1.5" 1.75" 1.75" and .75"!!

guess i'm going to play w/different primers and try 4831..next

I think I'd try lapping the first three quarters of the barrel, and then very lightly go thru the last quarter making it ever so slightly tighter than the first three quarters. Then after all this is said and done, I'd relap the first six inches of the barrel after the throat. Also are the three shot groups nice looking triangles? If not, I'd lap the crown a little bit.

One last thing to think about trying. I don't remember what scope and rings as well as the bases you are using. Might be worth your trouble to at least relap the rings into the scope tube. Myself, I'd take a night and remove everything, and remount the bases looking for burrs around the threads and the underside of the bases. Then I'd glass bed the bases. After that I'd very carefully install the rings looking for daylight between the rings and scope tube. After I'm satisfied, lap the rings.

sometimes the solution is just a bunch of small things
gary

 

[skeeterboud]

for what it's worth, and maybe someone can get something useful, here is an update. after the bedding and lug squaring, things looked promising. problem was that nothing was repeatable. a load that resulting in an inch group from a clean bore could shoot 3 inches the next day. I called Remington, again, this time talking to a different employee. this guy said that my gun definitely should be shooting better, and to send it in. I received an update about 10 days after I shipped the rifle back to Remington, and they said the barrel needed to be replaced. a few weeks later I received my rifle back, well, my original trigger and stock anyway! Remington supplied me their before replacement barrel target, 3.02" at 100 yds, Remington premier accutip 180 gr ammo. they also sent me the re-barreled target, 1.22" at 100 yds w/Remington core-lokt 180 gr. I was hoping for a little better than that, but I have plenty of different ammo to try, thanks to the original barrel.. wish I could have talked to the last guy right off the bat.

 

[cj518]

Had the exact same problem with a 2010 300 win mag sendaro. Sent back to Remington and would extract but groups where horrible. Went through load development with 2 different powders and 3 bullet manf. and was lucky to keep a 3" group on the best day with no repeatability. I have several pre 1980 rem 700's in factory setup and shoot lights out with factory ammo! Some said sell it but I am not the kind of person to sell my problems to others and chose to send it to a reputable smith and have never been more happy. This is what I had done:

Lilja 3 groove in sendaro taper
PTG over size bolt w/m-16 extractor and tac bolt knob
jewel trigger
CSR muzzle break
700 action blue printed and epoxy pillar bedded in H-S Precision stock
No turn throated for the 210 berger .005ths of the lands
Satisfaction Priceless!

 

[roninflag]

that is a good report.

 

[Remington5r]

I Agree with Angus- 5024 Everything he said is exactly what you need to do. If all of that fails then I would rebarrel it.

 

[Nimrodmar10]

Skeeter
I have the exact same rifle that you have. I tried several different powders and the Berger 190 and 210 gr. VLD bullets. It started out shooting about like yours. I did see that it liked the 190 gr. VLDs better than the 210s. Then I tried Reloader 22 powder. The groups closed up like bug holes. You might want to try my load.

This is the load:
73 gr. RL22
Fed. GMM215M Primer
W-W Brass
3.602" COAL which gives
.010 Jam Bullet Seating

This load chronographs 2976 fps in my gun. Of course you'll want to back off this load and ease back up to be safe. You'll also want to measure your chamber to see where the bullet needs to be seated to just touch the lands, then make it .010" longer for the jam. Shoots great and works well for long range hunting.

 

[scf]

Last year I bought a 700 xlr tactical,in 300 win mag. Could not get it to shoot very well so I sent it back to remington. They worked on it and sent it back to me with a target. Their target was 4 shots at 100 yards that measured 1.8 inches. I was disgusted and decided I had enough of Remingtons (this was my second new 700 in 2 months that would not shoot). I had both actions trued, put a Kreiger on one and a Brux on the other, put Jewell triggers on both and had them bedded. Now I have two excellent rifles in 7 STW.

 

[skeeterboud]

There is light at the end of the tunnel. mounted the original nightforce 5.5-22x50 and talley rings, a few boxes of factory ammo and went to the range tues. since this was a new barrel, it was cleaned before every shot. each ammo was tested by 3 rounds, three times. results are so much better!!
hornady custom 165 btsp 1 1/16" 1.0" 1 1/8"
hornady sst superformance 180 1 3/4" 1 1/4" 1 3/4"
Barnes vor-tex 180 ttsx 13/16" 3/4" 15/16"

really liking the barnes factory ammo. I have a sendero 300 win that shoots this exact ammo 1/2" to 11/16"!!! no need to reload there!!!!!

Nimrodmar10, thanks for the load. i'll try it soon. I have everything but the bergers

once again, thanks to all that make this site so great.