I'm in the process of starting a new 6.5x284 norma build, and I can't decide between the 130 Berger or the 140 Berger. This rifle is going to be my go to long range deer and antelope gun. For those of you that have experience with long range shots on deer with the 6.5x284,using either of these bullets,your advise would be greatly appreciated!
6.5x284 norma
- Thread starter Levi
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Well, before moving forward even with bullet choice, what barrel length and contour are you considering? I ask because I now realize that I should have gone with a longer barrel. Don't get me wrong because I love my little light-weight 6.5-284. It has a 24" Bartlein barrel on it with a gain twist ending at 8T at the muzzle. But when trying the various popular powders among the experienced guys, such as Retumbo and H1000, I will tell you my velocities at max loads were very disappointing. I was only rocking in the high 2600s to very low 2700s and that included H4831SC also. Those are all with the 140 Berger VLD, Lapua brass, 210M primers.
I will use this rifle for shorter range hunts here on the east end of the country but if I had to do it all over again, I'd go with a 26-27" bbl, a little heavier, like a 4.5 contour with the OD being around .650-.675 from a straight-line taper starting at .850, 4-6" from the recoil lug and I'd flute it.
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For what you are wanting to do I recommend the 140 VLD, either Berger, JLK, or Hornady. I'm going to be in South Carolina the first week of November and my primary test loads for that week are using a 130 Nosler Accubond. I'm hoping to get satisfactory accuracy/precision with Re19 as many references show it provides top velocities, and it is more temp stable than Re22.
My brother said a very long shot on his club is 300 yards so I'm hoping for 3" groups at that distance or less and I will call it a day, stuff about 30-40 brass that way and go hunting.
I'm still working on the 140 VLD too though but may stop unless I get around 2900fps with my current barrel along with acceptable accuracy. I'm seriously considering sending the barreled action to Bartlein and having them rebarrel with the contour I described earlier. I'd like to go back and revisit H1000 and Retumbo as well as Magnum powders but I now know that is a waste of time with my 24" tube.
My brother said a very long shot on his club is 300 yards so I'm hoping for 3" groups at that distance or less and I will call it a day, stuff about 30-40 brass that way and go hunting.
I'm still working on the 140 VLD too though but may stop unless I get around 2900fps with my current barrel along with acceptable accuracy. I'm seriously considering sending the barreled action to Bartlein and having them rebarrel with the contour I described earlier. I'd like to go back and revisit H1000 and Retumbo as well as Magnum powders but I now know that is a waste of time with my 24" tube.
If your barrel has not been started, consider a #4.5 but flute it. Prolly won't make much difference but who knows.
BrentM
Well-Known Member
I guess I think the heaviest bullet with highest BC is the best route. I have shot 160 Matrix bullets at LR they hit harder the 140 which is getting there flatter and faster. I personally don't even consider a 130.
I have 24" barrel and would go 26 personally. I am the opposite of Derek. With retumbo I get 2900 to 3000 easily. What I discovered today has me baffled and will be starting a new thread for some education on the subject. But I shot a some rounds at 3000 fps after dropping the powder level to 56 grains. My go to load used to be 57.5 and I was shooting 2970. Go figure.
I have 24" barrel and would go 26 personally. I am the opposite of Derek. With retumbo I get 2900 to 3000 easily. What I discovered today has me baffled and will be starting a new thread for some education on the subject. But I shot a some rounds at 3000 fps after dropping the powder level to 56 grains. My go to load used to be 57.5 and I was shooting 2970. Go figure.
I started out in the mid 50s grain if I recall and I never saw those kinds of speeds. This was the same day I was cranking 3050+ in my 270, 24" Krieger with 150 VLDs and H4831SC and my 7RM with 168 VLDs with 73.0 gr Retumbo going over 3000fps.
I don't think I saw over 2720 with Retumbo or H1000 and the berger 140. So, I'm guessing I just have a slow Bartlein barrel? Makes me very curious what would happen with a barrel change out to a Krieger or Hart, same contour, also 24" and same reamer used by same smith.
BrentM
Well-Known Member
I have heard of people talking about slow and fast barrels. I assume slow equals tight and fast equals loose but I have no clue. I get 2700 with the 160 right now and need to do some more testing. If I can get it to 2800 plus I will switch to the 160. BTW- this is a stock savage barrel.
I currently own two 6.5x284's, a Savage LRH, 24"barrel(.73" at the muzzle), and a Cooper 520 with 26", #5 fluted barrel(.78" at the muzzle). I shoot 140 gr Bergers and JLK's exclusively for LR deer/antelope out to 1000 yards with over 20 kills between 500-1000 yards. Both rifles produce between 2950-3000 FPS easily and have enough energy for clean kills at 1000 yards. Throating of your rifle will be important to get the most out of your load if you go for shooting the 140 VLD's. Retumbo powder is a good powder loaded between 56-59gr. The COAL loaded to the lands with a 140 VLD should be 3.18-3.19" with a Berger 140 VLD. At these velocities the hunting version of the Berger 140VLD performs on deer sized game from 50 yards to 1000. The 130's are OK for mid range work but the ballistic advantage goes to the 140. Both my rifles are under 10.5 pounds fully rigged and have 1:8 twist barrels. My personal preference is for a barrel on the heavier side for good stability for the longer range shots while still being manageable or carry with my medium build. IMO.
Using Berbers ballistic calculator, it seems that you are only cheating the wind by four inches @1000 yards with the 140 over the 130. I used a muzzle velocity of 2950 for the 140, and 3100 for the 130. It seems as the upfront speed of the 130 trumps the 140 in both energy and velocity out till about 700 yards. looking at the difference in sectional densities of the two bullets, and considering that Berger states 1800fps for reliable expansion, wouldn't you have less of a chance of a bullet penciling through at extended ranges with the 130 if you don't hit bone?
BrentM
Well-Known Member
If you can get 150 fps difference is minimal from 750 to 1000 yards. I am not sure you can gain 150 fps with a 10 grain weight reduction though. That seems a bit high to me. I was figuring 100 fps.
stomp442
Well-Known Member
140 bullet all the way. 53.5 grains of Retumbo gives me 2960fps out of a 26" shaw barrel with Norma cases and CCI large rifle primers.
BrentM
Well-Known Member
Stomp, what is your seating depth?
