4350 Powders

[dgkypke]

Ahoy Mates!
I have questions for the seasoned reloaders… I have 7 mid 50's and early 60's rifles that were Grandpa's. He was a gunsmith. A .243 Win, a 264 Win Mag, a 7mm Mauser, a 7mm Rem Mag, 2 .308 Norma Mags, and a .338 Rem Mag. I am starting to do the reloading process, and after watching this forum, was hoping to keep things safe, yet simple. Powders listed for 5 of these calibers is the 4350. 1 powder, 6 calibers sounds like a win-win. Looking through the Lyman's 50th bible, the mid weight bullets say IMR 4350 and it appears the heavy weights suggest H4350. It also claims that Accurate 4350 was created to compete against IMR 4350, but you can't use the IMR data loads. I have Accurate and IMR 4350, been in the hunt for H4350 for a year,
Am I totally wrong wanting to try to use one powder for all? All of the belted calibers listed, Lymans say the IMR 4350 propellant is very accurate. Toss on the next challenge: wanting to get exclusive with hammer bullets because of CA. so load development is even less available…
Ideas? Thoughts? Other powders?
Hunting Whitetail, Antelope, Mule deer, wild boar, Elk and Bear. Not trying for Groupings of minimal MOA @ 1000yard stuff. Ideal range is <500
Thanks everybody

 

[L.Sherm]

If it was me and you can get it H4350, its very stable. You may have to go with lighter bullets to get it to work with some of the mag cartridges like 264, 7mm

 

[Fedwell]

The Western Powders Handloading Guide Has LOTS of Loads using
Accurate 4350.
It seems to be a Good Powder as long as you use the proper Data

 

[LTH181818]

I used try to optimize the best rifle powder for each cartridge. Ten years ago I started loading everyting with H4350 or H1000, just to simplify. Happy I did.

 

[P7M13]

In terms of burn rate, IMR 4350 is the fastest, H4350 next, and AA 4350 the slowest.
I do not mix load data from any of the three, because they are functionally different powders.
I also do not worry about temperature stability. Once you have achieved a satisfactorily accurate load for your cartridge, trigger, grip and steady aim have way more effect. Yes, I have seen a measurable difference (POI vs. POA) in a bench load developed in the winter (32ºF, 150' elev, 75% RH) when going to 90ºF, 7,000' and 15% RH -- but no pressure spike.

With coppers, you have a longer bearing surface coupled with a lighter bullet. I'd recommend going with a slower powder than you might choose in the equivalent grain cup/core lead bullet - i.e. a 225gr SP Hornady over 4350 in a 338 WM will behave very differently than a 225gr Nosler E-Tip.
A year ago, stumbled upon a holy grail in my 7-08 using 142gr cutting edge coppers over AA4350.

 

[L.Sherm]

For those that worry about a double digit ES not being in a single digit ES and then not take into consideration there temp stability of there powder is kinda putting the cart before the horse.
Last year I was hunting in Nevada the first week it was mid 60's the day I shot my buck it was -5 I'm glad I was using H1000.

 

[Deleted member 107796]

Ahoy Mates!
I have questions for the seasoned reloaders… I have 7 mid 50's and early 60's rifles that were Grandpa's. He was a gunsmith. A .243 Win, a 264 Win Mag, a 7mm Mauser, a 7mm Rem Mag, 2 .308 Norma Mags, and a .338 Rem Mag. I am starting to do the reloading process, and after watching this forum, was hoping to keep things safe, yet simple. Powders listed for 5 of these calibers is the 4350. 1 powder, 6 calibers sounds like a win-win. Looking through the Lyman's 50th bible, the mid weight bullets say IMR 4350 and it appears the heavy weights suggest H4350. It also claims that Accurate 4350 was created to compete against IMR 4350, but you can't use the IMR data loads. I have Accurate and IMR 4350, been in the hunt for H4350 for a year,
Am I totally wrong wanting to try to use one powder for all? All of the belted calibers listed, Lymans say the IMR 4350 propellant is very accurate. Toss on the next challenge: wanting to get exclusive with hammer bullets because of CA. so load development is even less available…
Ideas? Thoughts? Other powders?
Hunting Whitetail, Antelope, Mule deer, wild boar, Elk and Bear. Not trying for Groupings of minimal MOA @ 1000yard stuff. Ideal range is <500
Thanks everybody

Your thinking is agreeing with much of the data out there for both H4350 and IMR4350. While any caliber can be optimized with other powders, these two show up as "most accurate load tested" in many cases and deliver great velocity. They are different beasts to a small extent, though. I load IMR4350 or H4350 for 257rbts, 270win, 270wsm, 7wsm, 300wsm, 325wsm and 338wm. With proper ladder testing, I think you'll get excellent results.

 

[dgkypke]

I used try to optimize the best rifle powder for each cartridge. Ten years ago I started loading everyting with H4350 or H1000, just to simplify. Happy I did.

Glad to hear…

 

[dgkypke]

In terms of burn rate, IMR 4350 is the fastest, H4350 next, and AA 4350 the slowest.
I do not mix load data from any of the three, because they are functionally different powders.
I also do not worry about temperature stability. Once you have achieved a satisfactorily accurate load for your cartridge, trigger, grip and steady aim have way more effect. Yes, I have seen a measurable difference (POI vs. POA) in a bench load developed in the winter (32ºF, 150' elev, 75% RH) when going to 90ºF, 7,000' and 15% RH -- but no pressure spike.

With coppers, you have a longer bearing surface coupled with a lighter bullet. I'd recommend going with a slower powder than you might choose in the equivalent grain cup/core lead bullet - i.e. a 225gr SP Hornady over 4350 in a 338 WM will behave very differently than a 225gr Nosler E-Tip.
A year ago, stumbled upon a holy grail in my 7-08 using 142gr cutting edge coppers over AA4350.

Thank you!

 

[dwinmeade]

When I started reloading (and not knowing one powder from another), at my local gun shop, I asked Tim (owner) what powder do I start with. Him and 3 of his (eavesdropping) customers all said together..."H4350". I ended up shooting my best 6.5CM group with H4350. I reloaded 350 6.5CM rds for a buddy using H4350.

Now that I'm low on H4350, I've heard that RL17 mimics H4350. I've been using RL17 in my 243AI w/Sierra 80g SBT...+/- 0.2500" groups, depending on the day (me actually).

The powders I reach for first:
*H4350/RL17-(6.5CM/243AI)
*RL10x/AR Comp-(223/6.5 Grendel)
*H335-(6x45)
*IMR4064-(on standby)

 

[Mike Matteson]

I have all those rifles except the 243. I use H4350, H4831, when I can get it H1000 I will put that into play. The 338 WM I use Win-760, which I still have to do temper check on the powder. The 338WM load is W-760 powder was develop in hot weather, so I do not worry about the high temp's, but cold weather I don't know yet. I do hunt in -20 to 100+ temp weather. I hold my shot to about 500yds. In my 308 N.Mag in I use H4350 at 3300fps with a 165gr AccruBond bullet now. Some inside info on the 308 NM that I load for. I use 300WM brass to start with. I FL size them to 308 NM cases and cut the necks for thickness. After fire forming the brass. I use a 300WM neck sizing die to sizes the cases. It only size about 1/2 the neck. It stop the case stretch. I was going through cases in about 3 to 5 firing before that. It change to loose primer pockets after that. in 10 to 14 firing. I was also splitting necks in 5 or so firing. Annealing ended that. I came up with this in early 2000 not really knowing why or how it was effecting my cases. I now I have learn of a new process in correcting primer pockets. I haven't put into use, but I will. Presently I am thinking of having Redding to built me a 308NM busting dies to use. I am in the process of getting Redding bushing FL dies for my other rifles. I never use bushing dies to bump my cases, but can see the value in doing that. I neck sized for a great many years.
I have first hand experience with IMR powders and temperature changes. That happen in 2000. Blow a primer out of a case in my 308 NM rifle in the early summer. Load was develop in the late winter. Temperature changed about 50 degrees. The load were hot in the winter and really got hot in the early summer. Loads being are flat primers, no ejection marks.

 

[General RE LEE]

I get very low velocities with my batch of Accurate 4350 in 6.5 Creedmoor. Kinda disappointed in it but thankfully I snagged 8lbs of H4350 a while back.

 

[Txhillbilly]

In a 6.5 Creedmoor IMR 4350 and AA 4350 both give slower velocities than H4350. Reloader 16 is close in velocity to H4350, and Reloader 17 will get you more velocity.

 

[dgkypke]

I have all those rifles except the 243. I use H4350, H4831, when I can get it H1000 I will put that into play. The 338 WM I use Win-760, which I still have to do temper check on the powder. The 338WM load is W-760 powder was develop in hot weather, so I do not worry about the high temp's, but cold weather I don't know yet. I do hunt in -20 to 100+ temp weather. I hold my shot to about 500yds. In my 308 N.Mag in I use H4350 at 3300fps with a 165gr AccruBond bullet now. Some inside info on the 308 NM that I load for. I use 300WM brass to start with. I FL size them to 308 NM cases and cut the necks for thickness. After fire forming the brass. I use a 300WM neck sizing die to sizes the cases. It only size about 1/2 the neck. It stop the case stretch. I was going through cases in about 3 to 5 firing before that. It change to loose primer pockets after that. in 10 to 14 firing. I was also splitting necks in 5 or so firing. Annealing ended that. I came up with this in early 2000 not really knowing why or how it was effecting my cases. I now I have learn of a new process in correcting primer pockets. I haven't put into use, but I will. Presently I am thinking of having Redding to built me a 308NM busting dies to use. I am in the process of getting Redding bushing FL dies for my other rifles. I never use bushing dies to bump my cases, but can see the value in doing that. I neck sized for a great many years.
I have first hand experience with IMR powders and temperature changes. That happen in 2000. Blow a primer out of a case in my 308 NM rifle in the early summer. Load was develop in the late winter. Temperature changed about 50 degrees. The load were hot in the winter and really got hot in the early summer. Loads being are flat primers, no ejection marks.

We should chat more about the .308 Norma stuff on the side!