280ai vs 284 Winchester

[tooth doc]

Makes ZERO sense to want a Rifle or cartridge that you cannot find brass or full loads for. especially in these times you want a gun that you can find ammo for anywhere. 30-06, 308, 38spl, 357,45, 22, 7mm,8mm, ETC. in these crazzzzy times you want what is ready available.

On this note i bought 280 AI off the shelf at cabelas last week. No 284, or much else there for that matter

 

[gslindy]

I'm building a super lightweight mountain hunting rifle and because of the ammo shortage I'm starting to question my caliber choice. I was firmly set on the 280ai but I can't find a piece of 280ai brass anywhere. I don't have dies and they are providing hard to find too. I am starting to lean towards the old 284 Winchester. Good quality Brass seems to be available from Norma, Peterson and lapua and for some reason it's in stock. The dies are in stock too. Here's the question. I've never shot a 284, I've had a 6.5-284 but never a 284. I don't know what kind of performance I can expect. The rifle will be built on a long action either way so I will have extra room for the 284 to breathe. What kind of performance difference should I expect between the two out of a 22" barrel with 160 class bullets?

I found a good bit of 280ai brass at teton river outfitters in Pierre a few months ago. I picked up a Ruger No.1 in 280AI earlier in the year and plan to load for it. I have a few 284 variants and would jump all over a .284 Winchester if I could find one. Good luck!!!

 

[window licker]

Go with the 284, I shot one for years in the larger field type matches, and hunted with one as well. One of the most consistent rounds out there. Lapua is now offering 284 brass. Before you had to buy 6.5-284 brass and neck it up, this created its own problems. I ran a 180 vld at 2850 with H4831. I would imagine at 22" 2750-2775 is what you would get.

 

[VLD Pilot]

I'm building a super lightweight mountain hunting rifle and because of the ammo shortage I'm starting to question my caliber choice. I was firmly set on the 280ai but I can't find a piece of 280ai brass anywhere. I don't have dies and they are providing hard to find too. I am starting to lean towards the old 284 Winchester. Good quality Brass seems to be available from Norma, Peterson and lapua and for some reason it's in stock. The dies are in stock too. Here's the question. I've never shot a 284, I've had a 6.5-284 but never a 284. I don't know what kind of performance I can expect. The rifle will be built on a long action either way so I will have extra room for the 284 to breathe. What kind of performance difference should I expect between the two out of a 22" barrel with 160 class bullets?

Lightweight mountain rifle (hunting ) spells short action to me. That's going to be the lightest option. The 284 CAN effectively be utilized in a SA with 160 class bullets and got in magazines easily without losing much. That would be my choice. Run the 160 class bullets at 2.950. Achieving 2900-2925 is very realistic in a 22" barrel with 160s. Downside, 160 class bullets is the max weight bullet for a SA, performance wise. Good luck.

 

[Rhino55]

This is very interesting thread! I'm want to build a Mountain Rifle too based on the 284. I have built several 6.5x284s and people love them! I use 57 grs of H 1000 and magnum Fed 215 primers. Getting great performance and groups. Keeping the speed under 3000 FPS to help with the throat erosion. On my mountain rifle. I will be using a blue printed Remington LA receiver DBM and a PT&G one piece bolt. Bartlein Carbon fiber barrel with a 1-8 twist. Have not made up my mind to go stock or chassis yet.

 

[VLD Pilot]

This is very interesting thread! I'm want to build a Mountain Rifle too based on the 284. I have built several 6.5x284s and people love them! I use 57 grs of H 1000 and magnum Fed 215 primers. Getting great performance and groups. Keeping the speed under 3000 FPS to help with the throat erosion. On my mountain rifle. I will be using a blue printed Remington LA receiver DBM and a PT&G one piece bolt. Bartlein Carbon fiber barrel with a 1-8 twist. Have not made up my mind to go stock or chassis yet.

Checkout the Iota Kremlin stocks. Bought one for my lightweight build a few months ago. Love it. Not the lightest stock (36oz) but a nice hunting stock.

 

[Coyote Shadow Tracker]

6.5x284 Great choice. I am real partical to the 6.5. Have several .260s and it is my main shooter. Just tried to get Lepua Brass 284 Win. CAN'T. Lepua just came out in 2021 with this claiber, can't imagine why they waited so long. This is one caliber I wanted to build myself, but have rifles just sitiing in my safes. Hard to justify getting another one. I told my wife that she should and would be happy with this caliber. She has many pistols and several rifles so this would be a good addition in here inventory. Anyone see Lapua brass in stock please advise. I also need a good set of Match Dies. I have been using RCBS Match. Any other suggestions on Match Dies?

 

[Rhino55]

Checkout the Iota Kremlin stocks. Bought one for my lightweight build a few months ago. Love it. Not the lightest stock (36oz) but a nice hunting stock.

I just ran out of the Old Greybull stocks and he went out of business. Love that stock! I see Stockys has a stock similar too it. I'm leaning toward a chassis with a folding stock so I can use a longer barrel when packing it.

 

[Coyote Shadow Tracker]

Bell & Carlson Sporter about 36 oz. with a packmyer pad. Installed one on a 700 DM .243 22". weighs in with glass 7.5#s. Add a few onces more with LA and 24" barrel. I can carry for weeks and almost shoot one hand. Compaired to my LR rifles-it's a feather lite.

 

[dfryabq]

Have owned rifles chambered in 284 Win since 1983. Have rebarreled the original SA Ruger several times. Had mag box lengthened to accept a loaded round with an OAL of 3.050". Own a custom reamer with a .317" neck requires a bit of neck turning. Throat is a 1 degree 30 min angle and is setup for the 168 VLD to engage lands .010". Current barrel is 23" long, a rechambered Rem 700 7-08.

Recently acquired a LA Rem also chambered in 284 Win with a .3165" neck also a 1 1/2 degree throat angle. Use same setup with my K and N neck turning tool. This one has a 28.5" 1 in 7 3 groove lilja and shoots 180 berger target hybrids into bugholes.

Best results will be with H4350 or if you want a bit more velocity, RL-17.

LA Rem 284: 180 target hybrid and 52 gr of RL-17 2800 fps

Currently SA 284:

168 Berger VLD and RL-17: : 52 gr RL-17 fed 210 match brass neck turned for .310" neck OD Reamer neck .317" Loaded ammo is .310" velocity 2925 fps
120 Nosler ballistic tip and RL-17: 58 gr of RL-17 3457 fps. seated bullet without changing seater die setup that was used with 168 VLD.



Generally you can get 3000 fps with a 140 57 gr H4350 and 2900 with 52-54 grs H4350 with a160 gr bullet using a standard SA magazine length around 2.85" or so. Or way back when it didn't exist IMR 4350.

Bob Hutton and Fred Huntington played with this cartridge when it first came out in 1963. Their pet load was 57 or 58 gr of IMR 4350 with a 140 partition for velocity around 3000 fps.



Anyone reading this should realize every firearm is different in what it can safely handle. Please work up with care.



TiminTerra PM me for specific load with a variety of bullets.

Ha, 57.5 grs of IMR4350 is exactly what I shoot in my A-Bolt with 145 Speer for 3000 FPS on its 22" barrel.

the A-Bolt has a short box but long throat and gives good velocity. 150s down worked great and regular cup and core 160s. 120 TTSXs scream and nocked the crap out of hogs, etc.

I have and old Winchester target action that is my back up Palma rifle that I am currently trying to decide 7mm-08AI or 284 for 180 Berger's for a dedicated 1000 yd match rifle, it does allow for ejection at 3.070", but still would have hybrids a little past the neck shoulder junction.

Anyway, the 284 is just a great cartridge and killed every thing in the A-Bolt from cow elk down to coyotes with it and never more than one shot needed. Having a Savage long action that I plan to rebarrel to 284 for 180's.

dave

 

[Huntz]

If I were you I would have Melvin Forbes build me a 7MM08 in his NULA with a 24" barrel and twist of your choice.It will be stupid accurate and MV will be close enough to either the 280AI or 284,both hard to find cartridges as it is and the 7MM08 brass is everywhere.If you want more Horse power 7SAUM is great.

 

[JMW67]

for an ultra lightweight I would most certainly consider what Huntz said the 7mm-08 would be a great option If you think you need a little more horsepower do the 7mm-08 AI

 

[Cloudrnnr]

I have a 280AI and love it. I'm sure the 284 would be just as nice, but I have a 6.5-284, and I prefer headstamped brass--which is just a little harder to find.

 

[AZShooter]

284 brass is available here:

284 Winchester - Rifle Brass - Metallic Reloading - Graf & Sons