.260 Rem & .264 Win Mag..??

[Sully2]

Ive seen both of these calibers bandied about on the bulletin board. Some people like one...some like the other...BUT...if ya get right down to it and compare ballistics ( 140 gr Nosler for example) There aint a heck of a lot of difference!!!

264 running right at 2900 with a sack full of IMR4350 and the 260 running with the same bullet at 2605 fps with a boatload of IMR 4895.

True its 300 FPS faster...but its TONS louder muzzle blast....and if ya cut the .264 back a tad your running 2752 fps. Not really much difference at all.

Why was I looking at my 260 as a LONG RANGE varmint gun????

 

[Scot E]

The .264 will push the 140's a lot faster than 2900 fps. But even with only 300 fps difference look at wind drift and bullet drop at distance. There is a big difference IMO.

I have never really considered those two similar at all. Except for them sharing the same caliber they are miles apart in every category in my mind.

Scot E.

 

[Korhil78]

The only thing that the 260 is superior to the 264 win mag is barrel life, case life and recoil. BUT, you have to ask yourself, is it so superior that you should choose the 264 win mag. over the 260? IMHO it isn't superior enough for me to choose the 264 WM over the 260 even if the the 264 WM is going almost 500 fps faster. If you are using the 140 gr Accubond in both guns, with the 260 spitting them out at 2650 and the 264 WM at 3100 it still isnt that big a difference out to 1k. With a 2 o'clock wind at 10 mph, the 260 calls for 8MOA right (83.3 inches) and the 264 WM calls for 6.3 MOA right (66 inches) and this is coming from the ballistics calc. from this website. With seeing that, I would take the lower recoil, slower, better barrel life rifle which would be the 260 REM. Keep in mind this is only if I was going to use this gun as a target gun. If I were going to be taking animals with it as well, I would choose the 264 WM because the Foot lbs of energy is a lot more at the longer distances. A lot more variables come into play that give the advantage to the 264 WM when going after game.

IMHO, one should be wearing hearing protection whenever they are shooting any high powered rifle. I wear electronic ears that enhance the sounds around me better than my normal hearing but muffle the really loud sounds. After a while of wearing them, you don't even notice that they are there.

 

[Sully2]

Just forget it. Neither of you see what I was attempting to say so no need to carry on. I never even began to assume the .260 was SUPERIOR to the 264 Win Mag....geeze

 

[Scot E]

Ya, I must have missed your point. You have me curious now! What do you mean?

With sentences like "There aint a heck of a lot of difference!!!" and "Not really much difference at all.", I guess I just missed your point somewhere.

Are you saying that you realize your 260 is much more capable than ONLY a varmint gun?

Scot E.

 

[Sully2]

Ya, I must have missed your point. You have me curious now! What do you mean?

With sentences like "There aint a heck of a lot of difference!!!" and "Not really much difference at all.", I guess I just missed your point somewhere.

Are you saying that you realize your 260 is much more capable than ONLY a varmint gun?

Scot E.

I use Hodgen powder and for the 264 Mag with a 140 gr slug they have ONE LOAD at 3000 FPS and nothing faster..??
A 140gr Hornady at 3000 fps at 500 yd has 2154 FPS velocity and 1442 ft lbs of energy

The same slut from a 260 at 2700 fps has 1907 fps of velocity and 1131 lbs of energy. Granted less than the 264 but not the fantasmical amount of difference you imply.

Personally if the animal wasnt as large as an elephant I personally wouldnt be cutting into it at 500 yds (Its referred to as "stalking")

Maybe that explains it...maybe it dont suit you at all....I dont care which!

 

[Korhil78]

Yes, out to 500 yards I agree with you. I would use the 260 everytime over the 264 WM. It's just that you didn't specify how far you would be shooting. If anyone was going to shoot over 500 yards then I would use the 264 WM. This is a long range hunting site ( I know that you know this) and what is long range to you might not be long to others so it helps to list how far you plan to shoot. And yes that 260 is waaayy much more than just a varmint gun!

I have a different opinion about this website than others. I don't care if 300 or 1500 yards is long range to you. I believe that if you have a question that you should be able to ask it and get answers from the knowledgable people on this site. Some people get bent out of shape when someone comes on here and asks about shooting at 300 yards or so because they don't consider it long range. It it is long range for that shooter and he should get the help that he needs to improve. I do think that there should be a Extreme Long Range Forum for those that shoot 1000 yards and beyond though.

 

[apexmtnman]

Hogden is ultra conservative on their 264 loads. I have 3 264's that all shoot 140 VLD's at 3200-3280 fps with a not too hot load of Retumbo.
Now run your numbers again with a 500-580 fps difference and tell me what you find.
It's like comparing a Volkswagon bug to a Corvette, they'll both get you where you want to go but which one would you rather be sitting in?

 

[Scot E]

I use Hodgen powder and for the 264 Mag with a 140 gr slug they have ONE LOAD at 3000 FPS and nothing faster..??
A 140gr Hornady at 3000 fps at 500 yd has 2154 FPS velocity and 1442 ft lbs of energy

The same slut from a 260 at 2700 fps has 1907 fps of velocity and 1131 lbs of energy. Granted less than the 264 but not the fantasmical amount of difference you imply.

Personally if the animal wasnt as large as an elephant I personally wouldnt be cutting into it at 500 yds (Its referred to as "stalking")

Maybe that explains it...maybe it dont suit you at all....I dont care which!

Friend,

I really am not trying to rattle your cage. Just trying to figure out your point. Still not quite sure as it sounds like you are back to saying there isn't that much difference.

Knowing that you are estimating specs at only 500 yards helps me understand your point though. Bottom line is at that range either will get the job done well so why go with more recoil, less barrel life, and more cash per shot that the 264 Win Mag demands! I agree. I really like the 6.5x55 for those reasons. On big game like mule deer sized animals and smaller there isn't an occassion where I am not comfortable out to half a mile. And I can still use the same gun for practice without feeling like each shot is taking away valuable barrel life. Having said that, the much more powerful Win Mag would eliminate a lot of potential drop and drift error and would likely make for a better option for anyone that can shoot the extra recoil just as accurately.

But once you begin to look farther or at bigger animals the game changes, for me at least. The 264 Win Mag can be pushed to 3200 fps easily, in fact most ammo manufactures pushed their 140's to this velocity originally but almost all of them have scaled it back in part to help with barrel life and also to eliminate liability.

So for example if you look at the typical velocity a premium bullet needs to reliably expand, most say 1800 but I like to go with closer to 1900 fps, you can see that you get much more distance out of a Win Mag. Even if you use an A-max which I have found to get reliable expansion down to 1100 fps or so, you still get way more distance with Win Mag. It's not even close. That was my point.

Sorry if I came across harsh or whatever. I was just trying to get to your point.

Scot E.

 

[Sully2]

Just drop it. You shoot what you wish to at 1900 yards and I'll pop jackrabbits with my 260 at 100 feet!

 

[Sully2]

Hogden is ultra conservative on their 264 loads. I have 3 264's that all shoot 140 VLD's at 3200-3280 fps with a not too hot load of Retumbo.
Now run your numbers again with a 500-580 fps difference and tell me what you find.
It's like comparing a Volkswagon bug to a Corvette, they'll both get you where you want to go but which one would you rather be sitting in?

If "H" is conservative with loads for the 264...then most probably they are the same for the 260.

And with pressures in their charts at 62,000 for the 264....they arent THAT conservative.

Check the Lyman reloading manual for the 264 is you think the "H" data is conservative!!....

 

[Korhil78]

Just drop it. You shoot what you wish to at 1900 yards and I'll pop jackrabbits with my 260 at 100 feet!

You are one sour person. People try to contribute not knowing what range you want to shoot at and you gripe. People figure out how far you want to shoot and they try to contribute and you gripe. Why don't you just start the thread griping about stuff and we can just cut right to the chase.

I hope that you have a wonderful week and I hope you get all the jackrabbits you want from 100 ft to 500 yards. That 260 will surely get it done!

 

[elkaholic]

Sully.....Not trying to be sarcastic here but you seem to have a problem asking a question and then not liking the truth? Do you post things just to get agreement or are you really wanting to learn something? There are a lot of good, and knowledable guys on this forum but if you continue to be so thin skinned, you will likely have a difficult time getting anyone to take you seriously! Not to long ago, you had the same attitude over wolves if I recall. Lighten up man!. A .264 mag will beat a .260 Rem velocity wise by at least 500'........Rich

 

[Sully2]

Sully.....Not trying to be sarcastic here but you seem to have a problem asking a question and then not liking the truth? Do you post things just to get agreement or are you really wanting to learn something? There are a lot of good, and knowledable guys on this forum but if you continue to be so thin skinned, you will likely have a difficult time getting anyone to take you seriously! Not to long ago, you had the same attitude over wolves if I recall. Lighten up man!. A .264 mag will beat a .260 Rem velocity wise by at least 500'........Rich

I know you arent the sarcastic type partner....but what I cant understand is how SOME dont bother to "read the lines"...but instead they read in between the lines and then attempt to interpret the meaning...

Some POST....notice I said POST...to the affect that if one isnt shooting gophers or 7 point elk at 1100 yards..they arent "he-men" or something??? I just posed the question that there ISNT ( and there isnt regardless of how you look at it other than the numbers themselves) a LOT of difference. Difference...yeah..sure there is...but not some "one ton" gap between the two.

And after all...if we can watch a movie here of some little girl shooting an elk at 8?? yards with a 243...I wouldnt be so hard on those lowly 260 shooters!!!