I just Can't help it, 338-06 AI er ?

med358-boise · Jan 5, 2025

Bobcatter said:
I have heard more complaints from hunters using solid copper bullets than anything else. Mostly because they have such a narrow velocity spread for optimum use. But Like I said, Copper is out! for accuracy and ease of loading, with the widest working velocity spread I've seen over the years, there are only two jacketed, non-partition bullets I will consider, Accubonds, or Scirocco's.

I am almost positive the Accubonds have my vote of confidence. from antelope to. African plains game, I hear the least, nearly zero complains on their performance. As I already said, I don't put much faith in reviews stating how great they are, to many variables get left out on why they worked that time. But you will always hear about any failure with anything from components to equipment. I don't hear complaints on the performance of the Accubonds. Neither terminal performance, or accuracy. I want to know that they will perform at 3000 fps- to 1800 fps, the bonded bullets have been very reliable in that range.

My only decision will be, 200 grain,,, or 225. If I ever hunted the largest most dangerous game with this rifle,, it will be using either a 250 grain Swift A-Frame, or a Nosler Partition, in that order.

I didn't read all the posts. But that is an interesting point of view. I have used Barnes TSXs and TTSXs almost exclusively 15 plus years and never a problem, very few recovered because of exit wounds and have not lost an animal. Most Barnes have a minimum impact velocity of 1800 some as low as 1500 to 1600. It actually varies by caliber and weight. But clearly your mind is made up, so enjoy your rifle and the accubonds they are a good bullet.

One thing I always find interesting about hunter's complaints about failed bullets. The majority of them talk about lost animals and the majority include the statement "it was a good shot" or even "a perfect shot". But given most of us can't see our hits because of recoil, the vast majority of the time we only have a good idea of where we were holding and no "evidence of where the bullet struck". Yet, the majority of these hunters are absolutely convinced it was a good to great shot but they have zero evidence of that. They will even claim the lack of a blood trail is proof it was a failure to expand and they completely disregard the simplest answer...which is they missed. Trust me bullet failures do happen but interestingly enough the best evidence is the recovered failed bullet from a dead animal.

You will love the 338-06. I had one in Custom Mauser with octagon barrel and took this Wyoming 6x6 on (the right) with (funny enough) a 200 grain accubond. Have a great evening.

Shane Lindsey · Wednesday at 1:25 PM

Varget has been my go-to with similar cartridge. Definitely not top speed, but accurate.

Bobcatter · Thursday at 8:13 AM

Shane Lindsey said:
Varget has been my go-to with similar cartridge. Definitely not top speed, but accurate.

This is my goal Shane, thanks for the confirmation, for anything from Antelope to Elk, as far as 400 to 500 yards, is what is being intended for. This cartridge has the power with good hunting bullets to make quick clean one shot kills easily on those animals with up to 200 grain bullets. The only requirement for those loads to do that is enough accuracy to put them where they need to be. That is for bullets 200 to 210 grains anyways where I am going to concentrate my efforts for a hunting load.

I think you'll find Varget to be pretty close to giving as much velocity as about any powder you can get enough in the case to reach their top pressure with the lighter bullets in this caliber, and velocity. I know once you get to the 225 maybe, but the 250 grain bullets, it definitely opens more doors for slower powders to fill the case and still get their top pressures, to deliver more speed than the Varget loads would, but is substantial enough to mater at the closer range those bullets would be intended for?

I also am not as interested in accuracy for those heavier 225 to 250 grain bullets. Even 1.5 moa is plenty good for the most dangerous game even at 200 yards, and that is an awful long shot for taking dangerous game, or even Moose, which most likely the biggest and most likely game I will ever hunt with this gun. Even Moose is a pipe dream at this point, and 100 yards is more likely the distance these loads would ever be used for those animals, but 200 I doubt would ever be exceeded, and if it was, I think a second shot would be capable if needed. Which is all those big heavy bullets would be intended for.

But where i think the Varget will give me the best of accuracy and speed, is with the 180 grain AB bullet. This will be only for Antilope or Whitetail and Mule Deer. For those game animals 500 yards is a real possible distance for hunting opportunities, and the load most often used for this gun, which is likely to be used to hunt. Most accuracy available, and the least power capability of this cartridge is all that is required for DRT under these circumstances. I won't even rule out N135 or XBR 8208 for this one bullet under these circumstances?

I searched the internet for months researching options from 30 caliber all the way to 375. This just seemed the best cal to cover it all. That 35 was my toughest decision over the 338 cal. To be honest I actually was as intrigued with the 35 Whelen for it's bigger game capabilities. But think I was more impressed with the ability for smaller game at longer range with the 338 over the Whelen, a more likely used application at my age. Remember, I've mentioned adding a sporter weight 24" 257 Roberts AI barrel to this gun in the future, maybe this summer? That was what made the 35 Whelen even more intriguing for the larger game. But I know I'll shoot this even more, and be more likely not to build the second barrel, making the 338 the better one and done gun option..

Shane Lindsey · 2025-01-12T07:07:04-0600

Bobcatter said:
This is my goal Shane, thanks for the confirmation, for anything from Antelope to Elk, as far as 400 to 500 yards, is what is being intended for. This cartridge has the power with good hunting bullets to make quick clean one shot kills easily on those animals with up to 200 grain bullets. The only requirement for those loads to do that is enough accuracy to put them where they need to be. That is for bullets 200 to 210 grains anyways where I am going to concentrate my efforts for a hunting load.

I think you'll find Varget to be pretty close to giving as much velocity as about any powder you can get enough in the case to reach their top pressure with the lighter bullets in this caliber, and velocity. I know once you get to the 225 maybe, but the 250 grain bullets, it definitely opens more doors for slower powders to fill the case and still get their top pressures, to deliver more speed than the Varget loads would, but is substantial enough to mater at the closer range those bullets would be intended for?

I also am not as interested in accuracy for those heavier 225 to 250 grain bullets. Even 1.5 moa is plenty good for the most dangerous game even at 200 yards, and that is an awful long shot for taking dangerous game, or even Moose, which most likely the biggest and most likely game I will ever hunt with this gun. Even Moose is a pipe dream at this point, and 100 yards is more likely the distance these loads would ever be used for those animals, but 200 I doubt would ever be exceeded, and if it was, I think a second shot would be capable if needed. Which is all those big heavy bullets would be intended for.

But where i think the Varget will give me the best of accuracy and speed, is with the 180 grain AB bullet. This will be only for Antilope or Whitetail and Mule Deer. For those game animals 500 yards is a real possible distance for hunting opportunities, and the load most often used for this gun, which is likely to be used to hunt. Most accuracy available, and the least power capability of this cartridge is all that is required for DRT under these circumstances. I won't even rule out N135 or XBR 8208 for this one bullet under these circumstances?

I searched the internet for months researching options from 30 caliber all the way to 375. This just seemed the best cal to cover it all. That 35 was my toughest decision over the 338 cal. To be honest I actually was as intrigued with the 35 Whelen for it's bigger game capabilities. But think I was more impressed with the ability for smaller game at longer range with the 338 over the Whelen, a more likely used application at my age. Remember, I've mentioned adding a sporter weight 24" 257 Roberts AI barrel to this gun in the future, maybe this summer? That was what made the 35 Whelen even more intriguing for the larger game. But I know I'll shoot this even more, and be more likely not to build the second barrel, making the 338 the better one and done gun option..

190gr Mono at 2953 FPS from a 22" barrel.

Giddy up

Bobcatter · 2025-01-12T09:00:03-0600

Shane Lindsey said:
190gr Mono at 2953 FPS from a 22" barrel.

Giddy up

View attachment 634204

What does your rifle weigh, this is something many overlook. This are great groups, from any weight rifle in this caliber, nice work! I have seen many take a light sporter and expect to get the same accuracy they see others getting out of the same cartridge. They buy premium barrels, expensive stocks, try every suitable powder, primer, bullet. Change neck tension seating depth and end up with only twice the size groups???

Then they never take into consideration, those tiny groups came from a rifle weighing 17# instead of the 8# rifle they are shooting! This is why competition shooters don't try and matchup 300 Mag's against 6mm XC, Dasher, 6x47 Lapua, even 6BR AI in 17# rifles. Those 284's 30's, and 338's are reserved for the 50# rifles where recoil robbery is countered out of the equation.

I'm aiming at 7# complete with scope for this rifle. I may not get that light, but that is the target weight. I fully understand this will compromise some of the capable accuracy of this platform. It is also why I am going to first work with 180 Accubonds. I need the most accuracy, for the longest hunting I plan on using this rifle for, Antelope and Deer.

I'm hoping to find a load with the best velocity, best accuracy, under .75moa, which is what I need the rifle to be capable of out 600 or in ideal conditions 700 yards in open hunting conditions. This allows me very little room to add in human error, where less than rifle range controlled conditions get eliminated. 7 to 8 inch would be the absolute best accuracy t those ranges.

Shooting Benchrest for over 40 years as well as hunting everything varmint and big game, I've seen many confuse the reason each use different platforms. There is no doubt a 257 AI or 25-06 would hold a huge advantage over any larger caliber for long range hits once you start limiting the weight to 7# or less. The weight of a rifle will obsoletely limit how small it will shoot in any given caliber and bullet weight.

Elliott Fitchett · 2025-01-12T09:12:11-0600

Bobcatter said:
That Blacktooth stock with the 3D hex recoil pad is supposed to take harsh instant kick, and smooth it to a softer slowed down push. I was hoping some could comment on how well this stock does exactly that.

I have seen some folks drill the stock and put in a quicksilver insert that will mitigate recoil. it works quite well. that may be a way to go so you can shoot it with comfort.

Shane Lindsey · 2025-01-12T09:47:07-0600

Bobcatter said:
What does your rifle weigh, this is something many overlook. This are great groups, from any weight rifle in this caliber, nice work! I have seen many take a light sporter and expect to get the same accuracy they see others getting out of the same cartridge. They buy premium barrels, expensive stocks, try every suitable powder, primer, bullet. Change neck tension seating depth and end up with only twice the size groups???

Then they never take into consideration, those tiny groups came from a rifle weighing 17# instead of the 8# rifle they are shooting! This is why competition shooters don't try and matchup 300 Mag's against 6mm XC, Dasher, 6x47 Lapua, even 6BR AI in 17# rifles. Those 284's 30's, and 338's are reserved for the 50# rifles where recoil robbery is countered out of the equation.

I'm aiming at 7# complete with scope for this rifle. I may not get that light, but that is the target weight. I fully understand this will compromise some of the capable accuracy of this platform. It is also why I am going to first work with 180 Accubonds. I need the most accuracy, for the longest hunting I plan on using this rifle for, Antelope and Deer.

I'm hoping to find a load with the best velocity, best accuracy, under .75moa, which is what I need the rifle to be capable of out 600 or in ideal conditions 700 yards in open hunting conditions. This allows me very little room to add in human error, where less than rifle range controlled conditions get eliminated. 7 to 8 inch would be the absolute best accuracy t those ranges.

Shooting Benchrest for over 40 years as well as hunting everything varmint and big game, I've seen many confuse the reason each use different platforms. There is no doubt a 257 AI or 25-06 would hold a huge advantage over any larger caliber for long range hits once you start limiting the weight to 7# or less. The weight of a rifle will obsoletely limit how small it will shoot in any given caliber and bullet weight.

About 9# 8oz with the Swaro 3-10

Bobcatter · 2025-01-12T11:45:46-0600

Elliott Fitchett said:
I have seen some folks drill the stock and put in a quicksilver insert that will mitigate recoil. it works quite well. that may be a way to go so you can shoot it with comfort.

The lighter the better at my age, as long as it will meet the accuracy I need. Not a target rifle, and any weight makes it less comfortable day in and out. Recoil is one second out of how many days this rifle will be used? I am not recoil shy, I pursued it most of my shooting career.

Today I realize this rifle will be carried over 99% time during it's use without being fired. That makes weight and balance it's major priority. Of course with the ability to deliver enough accuracy to assure 100% kill shots when called on. My priority will be ease of use. It will solely be up to me to tolerate one shot when it is being used for what it is being built for, that will be less than 1 second for each week or two hunt I carry it.

I should also mention that from load development to practice, it will never see more than 3 shots from a cold barrel. This all this rifle is supposed to deliver, and will be how it used, on the hunt, as well as during practice. This what it;s repeatable performance will be developed for. I also wont call practice setting at a concreate bench shooting from a manufactured mechanical rest using bag's practice!

Everything about the use of this rifle will pertain to real world conditions for the purpose it was built for, once load development is finished. It also will determine if I "have" to add weight to get the accuracy it needs to do the job it is being built for.

I just Can't help it, 338-06 AI er ?

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